Hi! Im A Big Fan Of Astarions Character As A Whole (Spawn And Ascended) But I Dont Really Feel Comfortable

Hi! I’m a big fan of Astarion’s character as a whole (Spawn and Ascended) but I don’t really feel comfortable talking about him in a lot of places because of… you know 🫤 but I was wondering if you had any headcanons on his background before vampirism? Theres a few things I’ve seen that kind of imply maybe he wasn’t always a noble, like the ratcatcher line, or his unmaintained grave in a public cemetery, or that he’s really ambitious and strives to not be nothing/a nobody. Or even the fact that he’s a charlatan/rogue. I like to think that his drive for power and wealth comes from him being lower class at one point and he climbed the ladder on his own, that’s why he’s even more bent on having it again. Idk I could go on but I was curious what u think

Hello, thank you for your question! I have poor English, but I will try my best.

> whole (Spawn and Ascended) but I don’t really feel comfortable talking about him in a lot of places because of… you know I know, still this, gross. Poppsychology hysteria is very high. Evil Win is something that is not possible according to Anti. Pure Health or Abuse Tragedy. Although "I can heal\fix someone (narcissistic, immoral, traumatized manipulator) with the power of love, kindness, questionable therapy skills, "I'm proud" leads to the last one if you're so zealous in your health-psychology research. That "I love to hate it"-moment, bully instinct, whatever the means and methods. I'm sure if AA was breathing, Anti would find shit to throw. Absolutely destructive poisonous behavior.

Well, it's a shame this is happening to the fandoms, I hope it goes away in the next five years. The golden recommendation of fandom that I've heard - if you feel shame, discomfort for what you like - you close the door and leave the place, for your own calm and enjoyable time. When things like this happen to a fandom there's clearly something wrong with it, although that's a problem with many fandoms right now, it doesn't negate that it's wrong. All right, enough about that.

You are fortunate to enjoy two.

> but I was wondering if you had any headcanons on his background before vampirism? One of the biggest assholes of Baldur's Gate is my head for "Astarion before Cazador". I think it's a constant. > few things I’ve seen that kind of imply maybe he wasn’t always a noble There are no objective hints for me in the game for that. I can assume that option, but most of my thoughts are that he was always noble. There is one thing about Idle champions, more on that later.

>ratcatcher line No-no. Because that's the line for Original Astarion when he's already become Lord. It's a reference to his slavery to Cazador. That he was forced to eat rats. Not to his mortal life.

I'll add here too, that he was wealthy, with power, and he remembers that. But we're talking before even that and "was it always so?", this angle will also be detailed below.

>his unmaintained grave in a public cemetery He died 200 years ago, so... Maybe he didn't even have people close to him. It could indicate that he didn't have one in his mortal life who would have grieved his death for a long time. Either that someone is lazy or doesn't like cemeteries. I wish we knew more about it, but we have what we have.

>or that he’s really ambitious and strives to not be nothing/a nobody I thought he had ambitions. He is not without ambition. However, I now think his theme is one of pleasure, hedonism. Power and high status is a tool in his hands to live and flourish. The desire for power comes from the very beginning if you refer to the artbook. He wanted more. But why? And for what? So far I see it that he realised it was a power is fun, useful sickle, especially in the field of law, ruling, and without it, well… the chances of dying and not enjoying harvest that world has to offer are higher. I'm sure he was arrogant, proud of everything he had, influence, wealth, including his beauty and his voice. He liked it when his voice sounded loud in the hall. He sure liked being someone important. This was intensified when he became a slave, especially as he was emphasised all the time how small he was. It's a huge wound of the loss of everything.

>Or even the fact that he’s a charlatan/rogue Stephen Rooney loves the rogues in DnD. He said in one interview but I'll drag out the answer even more if I search :,,,,,) That in my opinion is the main reason, he liked writing a trickster. He was needed in the story. Knaves often don't have high status. They want it have by stealth. Being noble for archetype rogue is a pretty fresh concept. Also Noble may not be so important and there is something to aspire to, more, grander.

Charlatan's juicy moment in DnD 5, on which BG3 was written.

Charlatan Bonds «I come from a noble family, and one day I’ll reclaim my lands and title from those who stole them from me».

D&D 5e Player's Handbook Part 1 | Personality and Background 128 p. Charlatan

Now for more details about my point of view. A lot, I got inspired to write so here we go.

It's hard to speculate on Astarion's backstory if you start relying on canon, which I usually prefer to do. ***

And canon was…

The entire first act, some scenes are cut (3-4), others in shortened to 1-2 phrases as the dialogue with animation is removed, but it remains, as well as the approvals and phrases "chicky little pup", all written with the ideas that Astarion was:

Greedy for power, hunger for eternal life, corrupted elite from the Upper City. Who sold the criminals, gurs (they're "savages" in Faerun) to vampires as food, and then sold them into slavery.

Why… It's been so little revealed. Who took away a whole detailed story about how this horrible man became a slave (not perfect either, Cazador suffered for 200 years) and then became a sunshine Lord with the help of my corrupted Tav.

As far as I know, no one could force the developers talk about the main ideas about the story, writing it in an artbook, selling the artbook in a physical edition until now, plot which they might have thought to change all or part, and to give an interview to VICE and YouTube channel (in which he repeats wording from the interview). „A disgraced nobleman who used his position as a local magistrate to serve a vampire clan by feeding them prisoners, he was eventually too corrupt even for them and was effectively sent to serve as the personal slave of a powerful vampire”

Baldur's Gate 3 Features You Didn’t See In The Demo 14:12 „Vampires made him their spawn after catching him selling criminals into slavery when he was a magister. His punishment has lasted hundreds of years and Swen cryptically refers to something written on his back that when you finally see it, you'll be, and I quote, "oh f**k!” I wrote more about it here. It was a hook for the players. Which has now become a reason not to trust Larian at all. In my opinion it was decided to leave unrevealed in order to make the product more mass-market or Larian's team didn't have enough time.  

Larian also couldn't decide which character was Astarion. - Noble - EA - Courtesan - EA-time Charcter Sheet - Charlatan - Release

Or does it combine everything together? Courtesan is no-no for me, very. Could this be a reference to his slavery when he seduced people? When thinking of courtesans, it is rather presented as a forced choice: either poverty or this. Or fully a choice. For example, Cherie 2009. Where courtesans did make a lot of profit themselves, money not only to survive, but to live very luxuriously. In Astarion's case, it was simply slavery, of any kind or manner. Well, about the victims he could have knocked them out in a dark alley, or holding a knife to their ribs and brought them in. The explanation that Cazador made it such a torture for him to have sex doesn't convince me much. + Using Cazador to explain everything is meme, no plot, lacks complexity and the player's personal assumptions, impressions and experiences (grounded in the knowledge of psychology especially) don't add to it to the actual game. Music and acting unfortunately too. Weak scripts and cut content affects. So the "courtesan" as a reference to his slavery seems to me kind of wonky. If this was before Cazador, meh. There's a movie called "Dangerous Beauty", 1998. I don't remember it well, but I remember the woman had a choice of work, convent or Courtesan due to poverty. Did he really not want to work so badly? :,) Or was he really that poor and was lucky enough to get into a prestigious brothel, and further up the hierarchical ladder, because of need. (no, I don't like it) I don't think Astarion was forced to do that and he was so poor. I think it might have been a way to gain power. He could have just been from an impoverished noble family (so he didn't know how to work and hated it) and decided that the way of his beauty is more efficient. He got money and influence and became a magistrate. I don't like the idea still.

I can live with the word if it is used with the historical context of the Middle Ages.

Given how entrenched the word has become in the modern day, I don't think it could have been with this context.   But by the way fits perfectly with noble, charlatan and magistrate.

"In European feudal society, the court was the centre of government as well as the residence of the monarch, and social and political life were often completely mixed together. Prior to the Renaissance, courtesans served to convey information to visiting dignitaries, when servants could not be trusted".

(oh and the point that he doesn't trust anyone, he's seen how much betrayal there is in high society. In this case, Astarion could also seek influence through seduction, but it was his desire and no longer even out of need or habit. It could even be one of libertine entertainment, that's still profitable)

I will always prefer noble or charlatan. Charlatan fits, including on DnD.

Idle champions of the forgotten realms.

Among the items Astarion has are "Forged Potents of Nobility". But also the portrait of the Cazador, the Vampire Rapier. It could be an Easter egg out of context with other items, hint that he wasn't noble right away. He could, as Magistrate, engage in paper forgery and sell. And, wasn't Astarion hunting in the Upper City, maybe he had to have noble documents to get into some places. But since he was outside the law of mortals, like a vanishing shadow, he had forged papers. Yes, while I was writing this Astarion noble became canon again.

The Dungeons & Dragons 50th Anniversary Superdrop Post here It was an ad somewhere on instagram. You can see the ‘sound’ icon at the bottom, identical to Instagram. I tried to find it on the official dnd instagrams, but no results. Need THIS ALL very much. He was probably changed to charlatan because he has no status at the moment. Although for games, the archetype ‘noble’ is still connected to the attitude towards the world around you. ‘I'm better,’ striving for luxury, squeamishness, arrogance. So he behaved like that, but now he doesn't have that status and power - so the game decided to more correctly call him a charlatan who had his nobility taken away from him, like in the DnD5 book. Also he acted like a charlatan (most likely) when he was with the magistrate, so that point fits as well. Let's clap for Astarion, who is noble again. 💅✨👑 Clap harder because he do nothing for it, at all.

His age has also been changed several times, which is still a mistake in the game script and on the gravestone. In my humble opinion. - 350 - Death at 150 (Idle champions of the forgotten realms, first time) - 239 - Death at 39 (229 - 268 DR) (game BG3) - 263 - Death at 63 (Idle champions of the forgotten realms, after change) I'm no DnD expert so you're reading what I found and checked while I was writing, hopefully it will be ok here. Speaking of consciousness Being in the society of other races that live, grow up and die faster, elves adapt to this life and are already considered adults. There was a good example to explain: it's like a rather infantile 18 year person who already understands everything. Has rights and obligations before the law, if they live in a society other than elves they a full-fledged adult member of society. But emotionally tends to be more naively, maximalism, impulsively, intense.

After turning into a vampire, he didn't age, that's the point. How Cazador cut his back, his skin unrecovered? Probably the holy water, spell. How old is the half elf Shadowheart? About 40, she looks 25 - half elves age faster than higher elves. Astarion is a high elf how could he age faster than Shadowheart at 39 years - no way. Halsin is 350, he's a wood elf, but in DnD5, high elves and wood elves don't have such of the aging body difference. He looks older than Astarion by I don't know, like 10 years? When do High Elves get their first wrinkles? (sorry Astarion) Alright, in Larian's homebrew in BG3? Considering Shadowheart, Halsin and lil wrinkles Astarion, Idle champions was right here about 150 for a high elf, but 63 can be tolerated. *** So we have an extremely large space for headcanons about his backstory.

There's an option headcanon his backstory as a funny goofy hedonist. Possibly who could do evil things to the poor, vagabonds, “barbarians”. In canon we have one moment in Act 1 where Astarion tells his story with the Gurs. “They didn't like the decision I made” - 99% of the time that decision was unfair. I'm sure he was prejudiced before the attack. I don't think he tried to judge fairly, justly and mercifully those he considered ‘trouble makers’ and ‘barbarians’.

Also we have space for headcanons of how evil he was. (I think though he was a goofy hedonist at any way). Given the latest news with noble, I think he's been one since birth. Well, I'll keep the part where I little speculate about how he could have been non-noble, at the very beginning. And little about how writing his attitude towards the world (very noble).

I definitely had thoughts that he tried really hard to be on top because he was poor once. Though he likes skillful thieves, he has quite a bit of disdain for the poor, vagabonds, wretched, plebs etc. This incidentally reveals his status-issue, he became in that low status he hated. I'll give a few examples that can be shown glimpse hints of his past as a magistrate. Astarion: I've watched urchins freeze to death on the street. It looks peaceful - just like falling asleep.

The concept that he was “urchins” too, and hated it - possible, wanted nothing to do with this position, becoming noble he completely separated himself from this world. But no, I don't think so, I'm not close to that idea. I feel the mood that he was always noble, how mutch rich and influential? - is already that moment where I'm considering different options. Yenna approaches the camp to ask if they can stay.

Astarion: Absolutely not. We've hit our quota for mangy strays.

Minthara and Laezel react in a similar mood. Astarion, though, emphasises some aspect of poverty. Mangy stray. These are just few examples, there are more, approvals, hints.

There's also a scene about “Justice”. Which in my opinion is a hook to his past and the idea of his character, story. Narrator: A true champion knows justice and eliminates those who stand in its way. Restore the balance of justice. Wyll: Justice. No pardon without repentance, and no penalty without mercy. Wyll: The right path often lies between the extremes. Astarion: Mercy? Please - justice should be a harsh lesson. All the better to deter the next vagabond.

Player: I'm with Astarion here. Off with every criminal's head, I say. Wyll: If such violence is truly justice, then let it never again be called a virtue. ___ I think Stephen Rooney had a hand in this scene. This theme of violence, justice, about the dark side of humanity. Harshness can bring justice. It can become violence. Can become so corrupted and vicious that it ceases to be justice. (or has it always been a side that's always been kept quiet...) Can be in balance. Astarion hardly shares Wyll's point of view. Not to mention his history with vagabonds. The thing is... No one would care about mercy if a rabble of vagrants attacked your home. Wouldn't you regret trying to keep things in balance? The crowd doesn't care who was an honest man and who wasn't - everyone is a target. In that time and place (the Middle Ages) Astarion has a point.

Wyll literally said right, good things. Astarion: Mercy? Please~ It is XD yeah.

Astarion has the freakiest moral scales, always. In reality, he cares little about justice. He has an opinion about it. But it will still be "good, as long as it doesn't hurt me". If justice points its sword at him, he'll turn things around so it doesn't have to be that way. Will be proud if it's successful. He's not a wise character, even if he has a point in his story where the gray morality. I paid a little attention to it here. It's amazing how his character brings fun to the dark side, luring down the path of vice. Astarion has a picture of the world according to “evil” in DnD, “the strong survive, the weak die”, this picture is similar to Laezel and Minthara. But Astarion has no ideas or what he serves - his desires are the guideline. One thing is clear to me - he likes to live a pleasurable life, he will protect it and keep it in any way he can.

I'm also thinking… Astarion can ridicule and flips any reasoning about morality, principles, rightness, he doesn't really care, the main thing is to achieve whatever he wants. That's what he did when he was a magistrate.

So I'm closer to the idea that he was the golden boy.

Speaking of the Magistrate. One - something made him choose a good career about money and power. Perhaps something unpleasant, tragic. Two - variant he just realized by watching society that this is what you should strive. Reason was very petty, like he felt gOLd embroidered gloves were worth quite a lot. He didn't like the thought of counting gold. And his personality. It's useful and fun. Wearing poor or even average clothes and not eating delicious food - sucks. Three is a combination Lately we have been looking for reasons in the actions of the villain, psychological, subtle reasons - it was not bad, as long as it comes to the point that the more reasons the less he is a villain and just a “victim of circumstances”, it is already a tired concept for me. It's much more interesting when the reasons are there, but there is a distinct decision by the individual, where he clearly understands what and how would be right, but chooses wrongly. Astarion chooses the immoral path, he prefers it that way.

Why the Magistrate and not, shall we say, a merchant, a shipbuilder. Because the magistrate can tax everyone. To neatly circumvent the law, you have to know perfectly well how it works. :D Interesting, he loves Baldur's Gate, he's fascinated that this city is so great, a city of opportunity, he said. When he becomes Lord, he wants to rule it, or rather will do so again, in a higher status, a tiny pause of 200 years. He loves the heartbeat of this city.

There are other options, but here's how Astarion sees the city, a heart to bite into. Hot. In talking to the dead "that he was going to do as Lord" - rule and be free. Dead men don't lie. He wants to rule.

Could this be a reference to raw ambition and a desire to rule that he's had in the past? Probably. However, he said that there are many other cities in the world, perhaps this is a trick for Wyll.

But he could really easily leave the city with Tav\DU. So even ruling the city isn't his main idea. It's enjoyable, but there are other fun things too. The idea was to turn into a bat, evidently. And do:

Success. One more a constant thought: The choice to become a Magistrate was his willful decision. Astarion was looking for more power and a place at the ruler of the city. Only later did he find out it was boring quite a bit XD But the perspective of the place and what it gave and could give was very pleasing to him.

Speaking of family. For the full picture, it's worth looking at something I haven't done yet - how the High Elves settle into cities where races that live faster, and what that means for the elf family. There are options: either he had a family or barely had one. There are several other branches from that, the family's attitude towards him, what happened to them.

• If there was a family

A respectable family, who easily got everything he wanted. Probably started demanding too much. (Mommy may I?) I headcanon that his family may have been impoverished because of their honesty and lack of ambition. But not much, they still had status. Yet Astarion was affected, “money can run out, it's amazing”. It may have sparked his interest in power.

★ Astarion was adored by his parents.

He was cared for and protected. Perhaps nurturing in him an attitude towards other people, especially the poor "I'm better, my family is better, others don't matter". By guarding him, they could say: "Don't think of running outside the upper city, it's all muck". With a family like that not caring for the grave, I can explain it this way: - His parents was killed before he died. Maybe criminals, maybe a fire. He was left alone. - His parents died after he died. - His parents were so heartbroken that they left Baldur's Gate forever

☆ The other option is his parents didn't really care.

There are so many ways in which that could be. I prefer that they were nobles who disappeared at balls, loved their son, but did not know how to care and teach him, all this was done by servants and his friends such as children of noble. Here heartbreak works too and leaving town. They thought they had plenty of time...

○ If Astarion had no family.

Astarion still had status and probably a guardian who almost didn't raise Astarion. Astarion had his looks, money, and the society of the golden youth. (Corrupt nobility). I pay less attention to this option, but I like it just as much. It's a simple option, but that's the point. As in the case of the family that didn't care, Astarion raised himself, among children who had everything.

Speaking of personality. I also believe that Astarion has an inner desire to reach for "debauchery and darkness". Which is consistent with the idea – dark&fun. It's his core to be himself. As an example, he would steal when he had a lot of money, just for fun to cheat some clunky merchant and watch him red-faced. quite the rogue He was very mischievous. As he got older, his mischief became... well decadence level.

I think I've written a lot.

That's not all I think about this. But it's almost all I've found words for at the moment. The important thing is that my thoughts may change in some details. Especially since we're going to have a new artbook and what will Larian write in it? That could affect it, too. I've outlined the constants and the things I like about this story.

Thank you for your attention All the best.

I organized a mass ban recently. Someone could get there by accident because they liked a reblog-reply to a cringe, for example. But I tried to make sure that the ban was correct.

I can see him practising to transform beautifully and coming up with moves and gestures for it aww Or do it together when Tav can turn into a bat. And it will be part of their special dance.

My favorite canon detail about batstarion is that in the epilogue, when he's in that form and comes out of it, he does so very gracefully with a twirl. But if you just click on him to talk to him in bat form, he has the same animation you get as a druid getting out of wild shape. That lumbery, sort of clumsy transformation back into humanoid form.

Like he was caught off guard and didn't have time to transform back in the graceful way he likes. I could see him fussing and pouting over it. "Don't distract me in bat form! >:C"

idk I just think that's really funny and cute.

Lord Astarion's heart beats and blood rushes through his veins. My headcanon: his blood vessels are closer to the surface of his skin. So he's blushing from anything.

Tav recognized this on the night of the turn. He's running, climbing stairs, angry, annoyed, drinking and dancing at the ball, laughter, Tav says stuff in his ear - he blushes

He's holding back laughter here. I think context: My Tav reminding Astarion the name of someone noble, all the time joking about them, their affairs, gossip and rumors, Astarion having a hard time keeping a poker face

Consort's life with lord Astarion. To coincide with the end of batstarionweek2024.

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"Ascending Astarion is proof you only saw him as a sexual object" meanwhile the majority of smut and NSFW content about him I've come across (screenshots of him naked from every possible angle, fics with 99% smut in them, whatever sexual fantasies people have involving him or project onto him, etc.) is of Spawn Astarion and made by Spawn fans. The same people even ascend him for the sex scene so they can salivate over it and take hot pictures with their Tavs. With this being said, why the hypocrisy when it comes to sexualizing the character? Why is it okay when they do it?

This is why those who ascend him just for the sex scene and roll back their saves while, and I cannot stress this enough, also trying to play "holier than thou" when it comes to Ascended have no room to talk. Y'all know who you are. I've seen y'all in the tags and on YouTube on the Ascended sex vids. I've seen people admit to doing this but announce that they've rolled it back and condemn the route itself as if they deserve a pat on the back for avoiding a fantasy situation. I get being afraid of getting hate due to the hostile environment certain events caused, but there's no need for this. Just roll it back and be done with it. That's it. None of us who like AA are going to shame you for it unless you decide to play the fool and attack others for genuinely going that route.

If I didn't know any better, I'd say that the shameless version of these fans is the initial target of our dear writer. They literally ascended him for a hot sex scene and nothing else but instead of sticking around to learn this ridiculous "lesson", they roll it back and do the same thing to Spawn because they have no consequences in doing so. They get both sex scenes without having to deal with Ascended's power trip AND think they have the right to criticize AA fans because they didn't choose to stick with AA. The only ones who suffer from this decision and poor writing are fans who actively want to interact with the character for reasons beyond sex. This is where the writer failed in their mission as they did not account for their target to spoil themselves and avoid their message entirely, thus targeting the wrong people.

This isn't knocking those who create that content since Astarion's whole thing surrounds sex, but those who create it yet insist on being critical of AA fans being hot for AA when they're doing the exact same thing with Spawn. It's the hypocrites. It's not okay that they can sexualize a character but others aren't allowed, nor is it ever okay to attack others over fantasy. You treat others the way you want to be treated, regardless if you agree with them or not.

Look, we all agree Astarion is hot. He's hot as a spawn, he's hot as the Ascended. He'd be hot as a mortal. ASTARION. IS. HOT. End of story. The childish policing has to stop.