Edelgard.

Edelgard.

Edelgard is what the fuck is wrong with this fandom.

They have to bend over backwards to defend her even though there is no defending her, than they're more than eager to drag everyone, especially Rhea, through the mud in order to prop up Edelgard. They have to come up with this asinine takes of Dimitri being the real racist when actively wants to help Duscur, more so than Edelgard cares about Brigid beyond using Petra as a bargaining chip to keep them in line and possibly force them to fight her war. Or Rhea brainwashing Cyril into hating his shitty homeland, even though he hated it long before he came (was thrown to) Fodlan, and even then he didn't like Fodlan right away because these pink haired fucks enslaved him. Or how Nabateans being genocided was totally deserve so that the Slitherers don't look so bad and therefore Edelgard doesn't look so bad for siding with them.

Edelgard von Hresvelg is the worst thing to happen to this fandom, to this game, and to this series.

If you look at what happened at Duscur, like really look at it, the whole thing really undercuts Edelgard's narrative.

"But Edelgard says Duscur had nothing to do with her."

This is what she says in the Japanese.

"What's the use of repeating the same words over and over again? Shut up and fight, you petulant little buggers."

She's basically telling Dimitri to stop bringing it up all the time. And the whole scene in Azure Moon isn't that Edelgard didn't cause it, but rather there may have been a mastermind connected to the Empire and the likes of Kronya and Solon. The game is implying that Edelgard was manipulated, but at the same time she's turned a blind eye to those she's trampled in pursuit of her goals while the prisoner is about how people can commit atrocitious acts and STILL believe they are in the right.

Hell, the reason why the Western Kingdom nobles assassinated Lambert undermines Edelgard's claims that if she didn't act the world would claim more victims as it wouldn't change. Here we have attempts at reform snuffed out not by the Church but by the nobility. Nobility that then turn around and side with Edelgard during the war with Hopes explaining that Edelgard will protect their positions by them doing so rather that pushing through reforms that elevate the commoners.

But then again, Edelgard's reforms are about her using her power to force her beliefs on others.

But then you look at those Western lords. Kleiman was made a viscount for the subjugation of Duscur, given the former nation as his personal territory by Rufus. Hard not to compare this to Edelgard promising Caspapa control of the former Alliance territory in exchange for his support during the war, no? But Kleiman was in on the conspiracy to kill Lambert, he knew the truth, but instead massacred innocent people for his own benefit and was given a title for it. Lonato was given a title by Rufus in exchange for his service, and the game makes it clear that him taking his people to attack Rhea while attacking villages along the way is a sign he wasn't fit for the role. Even Rufus, who had a title despite not having a Crest, simply wanted more power when he had his brother killed.

They did horrible things, causing innocents to suffer, just for power.

"But Lambert was made a king because of magical dragon blood when Rufus was the oldest son, he should have been king if it wasn't for Crests."

Rufus was still a duke, had his own territory, and simply wanted more power. When he got that power, he ran the kingdom into the ground and tried to have his nephew assassinated multiple times. Same thing with Miklan, who only got kicked out of his family over multiple attempts to kill Sylvain, not because he didn't have a Crest. And if anything, Rufus shows how dangerous a meritocracy can be because it all depends on who is giving out lands and titles. A shit leader appoints shitty officials. Hell, in Romance of the Three Kingdoms Cao Cao hands out titles and stuff all the time when people please him (and when they piss him off, he has to be convinced not to have them killed), and all he did was create a system where ambitious people backstabbed each other for power. Just like what we see with the Western nobles.

Meanwhile, the people of Duscur were falsely acccused, slaughtered like animals, the survivors oppressed and made out to be the real villains by those who actually were responsible for the chaos that ensued and profitted off of it by putting themselves in charge. Really hard not to see Rhea and Dedue bonding after the war over experiencing the same bullshit.

But people try to make it sound like the Nabatean genocide was okay, and that Dimitri is the real racist despite trying to get justice for Duscur and that Dedue should totally join the person who knows the truth about the Tragedy but keeps her mouth shut in order to further her own goals. Seriously, what the fuck is wrong with this fandom?

“I wish you were someone whose heart could be swayed by my words and deeds. If it were so, I would have done anything to make you my ally...”

"You are attacking the monastery; you're employing demonic beasts. You almost had your own classmates killed. My father is dead because of you. The closest thing I had to a home village was destroyed by the people you're working with and can't keep in check. You facilitated Flayn's kidnaping. The same people tried to assassinate Rhea *again*, attacked the students, and raided the Mausoleum, and it's all but a given that you orchestrated the bandit attack to have Dimitri and Claude killed. I am indeed someone whose heart was swayed by your words and deeds, Edelgard. What you don't seem to realize is that you've done everything to make me your enemy."

All you have to do is let Edelgard talk and she will eventually just tell on herself.

I have to wonder if she's actually incapable of keeping quiet, or if her lack of self-awareness is a condition of some sort.

This scene perfectly encapsulates some edelstands' mindset of just reading the scrip to "understand" the game, because it allows them more easily take Edelgard at her word, despite all the onscreen proof that show her as being a terrible person, such as the deployment of demonic beasts.

Considering the localization choices I found over the last couple of days, I can understand why certain fans thought Treehouse hated Edelgard. Because, yes, the game does make her come off a lot more harshly than she does in the Japanese. That the English version primes the player from the onset to view her as arrogant and distant, rather than a typical noble girl like the Japanese makes her out to be. But as a result of this the Flame Emperor reveal, the game's main twist, doesn't have the same impact it was supposed to. Rather than the reveal of Edelgard, who was initially the least suspect lord, being the masked person aiding the villains we've been fighting, it comes across more like it was expected that would be the case.

Instead, fans take Edelgard's cute side as the suprise. “Yeah, I know she did all that awful stuff in Part 1, but Part 2 shows that she's not that bad.” The translation flipped Edelgard's gap moe.

However, this also kills the argument that the translators hated her.

For instance, if she fights Byleth at the end of Part 1 she says “I wish you were someone whose heart could be swayed by my words and deeds. If it were so, I would have done anything to make you my ally...” In the Japanese however? “I wish you were the kind of person who could be moved by my words and actions. So I did whatever I could to get you on my side...” The Japanese version flat out confirms that Edelgard was trying to manipulate Byleth, but got erased and made out that she didn't really do anything of the sort. Likewise, mention of her using an information campaign to sway the citizens of the Empire who are opposed to this war, or that Edelgard is really puppeteering TWSITD are removed. Her route even has it's named changed, the symbolism of the safflower replaced with that of a red rose. And on top of that, the ending of her route tries to tone down the final smack in the face to the player. Gone is Edelgard consolidating power on herself to impose her will, alongside her admitting she has been waling the path of supremacy (hadou) which holds very negative implications, and the endings try to make it out that she did work to bring freedom to the people rather than simply imposing her will on them. Oh, and Caspar invading other countries while unable to control the Imperial army? He's merely sometimes reckless, whereas he has “victims” in the other routes. It wants to make it out that your influence prevented her from becoming a monster, rather than her influence turning you into one, putting her in the same camp as Dimitri and Claude.

Meanwhile, the translation makes the Church out to be in the wrong with the Rhea ending saying she rehabilitated the Church, and Seteth's solo making it out that he was intolerant towards other faiths before rather than him taking the stick out of his ass.

The translation mischaracterized Edelgard completely, making her harsher in the beginning but softening her up in the end. It destroyed the twist and message of the game, as supporting a lying tyrant is just a manner or being morally grey when the original game it was supposed to become clear that the player was played and became the baddie by their own choice. It even goes so far as to try to tell players her ideals are close to Claude's when her line was that she doesn't think their ideals are the same, making her more compatible to the lords who don't invade other nations following the war.

The game was meant to condemn Edelgard as a villain, yet the translation just shrugged off her actions and went “moral ambiguity, am I right?”

Because she's a fave.

100% just because she's a fave.

Did Edelgard hold a trial for Dimitri when she was "forced" to kill him? Or for Claude or Seteth and Flayn when she killed them too?

"She spared them!"

As if vanishment isn't a horrible fate as well. And she still didn’t hold a trial for them.

I suppose it is my lack of attachment toward Edelgard that makes me feel that way (me shaking Edelgard like : you were almost my favourite but your writing fails you) is that I see people saying that of course the Eagles siding with Edelgard makes sense in the Tomb (CF) because can you imagine seeing the Archbishop condemning your house leader without trial ? Someone you admire getting condemned without any fair process ?

Meanwhile I'm like

The Eagles siding against Edelgard makes sense in the Tomb (SS) because can you imagine learning that your house leader is involved in almost all the shit that went down during your academic year, including sending the Death Knight against you multiple times, and you almost died, and saw death around you, multiple times... And she was actively involved in it ? She was an active participant in it ?

It's interesting. I think.

You have no idea how happy it makes me to still see Lindsay fan art.

Thank you for this!

Admiral Lindsay Her Hotness 🫡⚓️

I think it started off as a misconception because, as far as I know, Dimitri's first support is also locked after a certain chapter, though I don't remember when.

And then it turned into Claude's support not only being locked after moment like the other two lords, but also locked specifically after Byleth gets the SotC, just like Edelgard. This way, people would say that Edelgard wasn't trying to manipulate Byleth by opening up to her only after she showed she can be useful, because "Claude does it too", so either Edelgard isn't manipulating her or they're both manipulating her.

You know lowykey I always wondered who first said that Claude's C support only opens after Byleth gets the Sword of the Creator since like. That's not true. Like not only is that not true Claude is quite literally the only one of the three lords to NOT have his C support locked behind a chapter. You can get it immediately so like. wuh happened

So, I said I was going to talk about this and here I am. Edelgard's death scenes, Japanese vs English script. First off, let us remember the translation we were given. Quote:

“It looks as though... my path...will end here. My teacher... claim your victory. Strike me down. You must! Even now... across this land, people are killing each other. If you do not act now, this conflict will go on forever. Your path... lies across my grave. It is time for you to find the courage to walk it. If I must fall... let it be by your hand. I wanted... to walk with you...”

Now the Japanese, using Wordvice as my translator.

“My path is... Is it going to end here...? Master... The duty of the victor... Defeat me, Master...! Even now... Many people are still fighting and killing each other in various places... Unless you defeat me, the battle... will not end... Your... Your path... Can only be found beyond my corpse... So, at the very least... With your own hands...! Together, we will... Walk, and...”

First of all, Edelgard is surprised she lost in the Japanese text. She expected that she would win.

Secondly, she uses the same duty of the victor line we see in Hubert's letter, which combined with her telling Byleth to kill her. The word she uses for defeating her, I've had other translators say it was her telling Byleth to avenge her. If we take “duty of the victor,” which will be soon used for taking down TWSITD and later Byleth taking ruling over Fodlan in order to prevent it's collapse, it ties her words together more. Killing Edelgard and going on to defeat TWSITD and then being crown ruler is Byleth's path, and unless Byleth goes down this path Fodlan will never know peace. If Edelgard lives, she'll try this again. If TWSITD get away, they'll try it again. And if Byleth doesn't accept the crown, then Fodlan will fall into chaos causing the people to suffer.

Then there's the last line, Edelgard will let herself be killed by Byleth and this will be them walking the same path together. Edelgard accepts that her death will help Byleth end the suffering that's happening, and with this they'll work towards the same goal. This is not her expressing sadness Byleth didn't support her or how she can't join Byleth.

I mean, she could still try to side with Byleth, live and make amends, but as she's saying this all she's activating her weapon. It would tie into her not having the self-control needed to accept her loss and live, and how she'd keep going until she either dies or wins.

But what gets me is that this same scene happens in Wind, not just Snow. Is it just a lazy reusing of the scene? Maybe, I feel it could also be calling out the similarities between those routes. The Alliance is the underdog in the war, to the point that Claude points out that the Empire would not accept losing to them, foreshadowing the loyalist movement mentioned in the route's endings. Byleth's conversation with Claude about not wanting to kill Edelgard the same as the one with Seteth, putting the onus on Edelgard whether they will walk a path together or not.

Edelgard does not in the Japanese version, though chooses to die.

It would set up a contrast between Claude and Edelgard as well. Claude's first impressions of the Church weren't good, and he wouldn't fight alongside them in Snow leading to his defeat. In Wind, Claude goes against his instincts and works with them instead, putting the trust in them that Edelgard says she never could with Rhea in the Japanese text. It marks Claude walking the path of enlightenment himself alongside Byleth, while Edelgard walks the path of the animal (with Claude joining her in Hopes). It sets up that Claude and Edelgard's beliefs, their ideals, are different as well much like how Edelgard pointed out in the Japanese version.

But I think that's the core of why this scene happens, Edelgard's ideals. Edelgard believes that relying on others teaches people to be weak, and the Church is bad because it's beliefs encourage people to not rely on themselves and even does charity. Edelgard did what she did, and helped TWSITD, because she believed that doing so would give her the strength needed to change Fodlan into what she believed it should be. The Japanese theme, that plays it's full version at the end of every route bar Flower, does mention she hesitated to go through with the war, due to her time at Garreg Mach regardless of route by implication, before finally deciding to do so. Yet despite all the horrible things Edelgard has done for the power she's accumulated, Edelgard is defeated either by the Church itself, with no real army except for those who supported them, or the Church aligned with the weakest army.

The meek shall inherit the Earth perhaps?

She was forced in that moment, facing a loss she can't believe is happening, to see that everything she has done up until this point has been for nothing. Her ideals fucking lost to the beliefs she damned.

In contrast, look at Moon. Dimitri was able to take back the Kingdom territory she had conquered, force her army out of the Alliance while at the same time killing her ally. And as the territory Dimitri controlled increased, so too did the size of his army whereas Edelgard's army was exhausted following Gronder. Edelgard is now facing half of Fodlan's might on her own while her own forces are diminishing.

So, she throws away her humanity in exchange for power, becoming the Hegemon Husk. And with that Edelgard loses what self-control she had. Dimitri offers her his hand, she instead tries to kill him. No accepting of her death, no duty of the victor, no joining hands to walk the same path. Just her wordlessly making one last attempt to win. The end, as Dimitri puts it, of Edelgard's path sees her come a beast. Hell, the Japanese name for Hegemon Husk is Hegemony Corpse Emperor, making it seem that who Edelgard was is now dead (just like her being brainwashed in Hopes when it shows up now that I think about it).

(I love how France puts it, Shadow of the Conqueror).

In the animal realm, the weak fear the strong who prey upon them. Edelgard was afraid at the end of Moon, plain and simple, and that fear stole away the last of her humanity.

Even with the parley, she says she showed because of a whim. She did it on an impulse, and it's clear from it that she really hasn't thought through her ideals at all. She'll blame the weak if her ideals don't work, and she has no idea what shape her reforms will take. All she's focusing on is increasing her own power, so that she may become strong herself. It's why she's pleased when Dimitri calls her such, acknowledging her strength. Edelgard doesn't think things through, much like what happened with hiring Kostas. Meanwhile, it's Dimitri who points out the flaws in her ideals as well as what Hopes!Claude plans to do. And it's Dimitri who cares about the sacrifices she is making, whereas all Edelgard cares about is her goal.

Dimitri's humanity is what turned him into the boar tearing enemies apart, but when he's freed of his misconceptions about his duties as a leader it leads to him being the savior king. Meanwhile, this route sees Edelgard lose hers making it so that she can't have the last minute realization and acceptance Snow and Wind afforded her. No redemption for Edelgard in Moon.

Meanwhile, Flower encourages her to keep doing what she's been doing because it fucking works. This is where the translation changed things, making it so the player could redeem Edelgard here rather than in Snow or Wind. To have her change her ideals somewhat, while toning down her manipulating her allies. It gives her no reason to change, so she does not and will go on to implement her ideals even if she had the appearance of growing out of them.