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Ascendant Astarion was driven by fear, but can you really blame him?

Okay so I just read the newest interview that mentioned Astarion reasoning behind his ascension was driven by fear and I thought it made sense?

Tho I don't believe that fear was the only force behind the reason of his decision to ascend, there's a longing to be alive again to enjoy everything that the world has to offer, the need for certainty and also to protect his loved ones (when he has a love interest)

But let's talk about this fear part, there are people (even the companions) who expected that 'he should have known better' or 'shouldnt even think about ascension' and sees this fear in the recent interview as something that is so horrid but here's the thing.

"You are right to be afraid." I mean DUH obviously it makes sense. Astarion lives in a very dangerous world where countless undead risen from their graves thanks to necromancer toying with life and death, there are bandits everywhere, monsters, evil gods who never failed to make life even more miserable than ever and even the supposedly good aligned god can be so awful at times, etc etc.

The party that he traveled with and himself were infected with worms that would eat their brain and transformed them into a living husk, the absolute cult and the dead three were on their tail, angry devils, Cazador wanted him back and not to mention the Githyanki and their lich queen wanted them dead as well for what happened with the prism

Even during act 3 where they were supposedly close to victory. The victory was not set in stone yet, nothing is certain and something could have gone wrong. They could have died or even worse!

Not to mention he's a man who was tormented for 200 hundred years. He was stripped of everything that he had and even his own reflection, reduced to catched rats to sustain himself.

Can you really blame him for wanting to seek a way out from Cazador's torment, the hunger for blood and the indignity that he suffered for so long?

Also it would be harder to convince him to not ascend if Tav or Durge romanced him. Because now he's not just afraid for his own safety and his future but also his lover. The only person whom he ever love and genuinely love him back in 200 years (also not ending up as a victim for Cazador)

Most people would have killed him when they found that he's a vampire and infected with an Illithid parasite. Most people would have abandoned him

Tav/Durge was the only light in his life after years of living in darkness and torment, you can't really blame him for wanting to keep this light from being snuffed out by untimely death

And if that means sacrificed 7000 souls that he already damned anyway (undead like vampire wouldn't be accepted by good aligned gods in the after life, not sure about evil gods but most deities most won't accept them) so be it

I don't see this fear behind his decision as something that is objectively awful? I mean it is a natural respond anyone would have if they were in his shoes

Then you might ask "If Astarion loves Tav or Durge that much why he insisted on turning them into a vampire? And break up if they refused?"

Because he was overwhelmed by his beating heart/ his renewed sense, the high from his power and he's also insecure. At that point in act 3 he expected Tav and Durge to stand by his side no matter what

Because they were the only person who didn't kill the parasite infested vampire spawn at the beach, who loves him anyway despite the face he was a man with nothing to his name, who were willing to sacrifice 7000 souls and killed the Gur for him!

Ascended Astarion didn't want THAT special person to be taken by early death or a fate worse than death

He needed the reassurance that his love would be safe and no gods nor fate will take them away

If they refused to be an immortal vampire then they were as good as sealed their fate to death. Astarion didn't want to face that heartbreak

The thing that I don't agree with the interview is that the interpretation that ascension sent him to a horrible place? It was kinda vague? Like worse place when? During or after the ascension? Because this cannot apply after the ascension since I have taken so many screenshot and recording of ascendant astarion and I didn't see him feeling miserable about his fate. He was happy that the hunger gone and he could see his reflection again

Post final battle? The epilogue? After the epilogue party? This cannot be applied to all people, all route, all Tav/Durge and Astarion in general because there's variations. I mean you might see ascended Astarion as a bit lonely because he doesn't end up with anyone but in my Tav's universe he has a consort who stay by his side and their relationship is still going strong because my Tav is aligned with him

Put the Stars to Shame: A Gale x Tav playlist

Letter To An Old Poet by boygenius ~~ Last Words of a Shooting Star by Mitski ~~ Through Me (The Flood) by Hozier ~~ Dog Days are Over by Florence + The Machine ~~ Northern Attitude by Noah Kahan & Hozier ~~ First Light by Hozier ~~ Hello my Old Heart by The Oh Hellos ~~ Graceland Too by Phoebe Bridgers ~~ Has Anyone Ever Written Anything for You by Stevie Nicks ~~ Home to Me by Devil and the Deep Blue Sea ~~ Something Just Like This by The Chainsmokers & Coldplay ~~ Inkpot Gods by The Amazing Devil ~~ Fair by The Amazing Devil

Meta, commentary, and extracts for each song under the cut :)

Letter to an Old Poet

You’re not special, you’re evil / you don’t get to tell me to calm down / you made me feel like an equal / but I’m better than you, and you should know that by now

Slate has a lot of baggage in her life, coming from an abusive long term relationship with Malus and abusive parents, and escaping indentured servitude (read: slavery). Despite that, she has survived, though with deep scars. She has the same theme of ‘abuse’ as the other origin characters, except rather than breaking free of those toxic relationships, she is dealing with the aftermath of leaving abuse behind and how to survive beyond it.

Last Words of a Shooting Star

I always wanted to die clean and pretty / but I’d be too busy on working days / so I am relieved that the turbulence wasn’t forecasted / I couldn’t have changed anyway

From Gale’s perspective after being infected with the tadpole. With the orb, he wanted to be able to die meaningfully and in forgiveness, not in body horror ceremorphosis. Ultimately though, he was prepared to die, this is just an unexpected method. It could be worse- he is relieved that he is far from those he loves, and that his affairs are mostly in order. At least this way, he thinks, his death won't be as hard on Tara and his mother (they’ll think of me kindly / when they come for my things)

Through Me (The Flood)

Picture a man /... swimming out beyond the breakers / like he's done his life before / he feels a coming of the squall / will drag him out a greater length / but knows his strength, and tries to gather it / and he swims on

Following their abduction, Slate and Gale’s situation seems hopeless, and it seems foolish to waste energy struggling. Nonetheless, they join up with the rest of the party, gathering their strength to meet the oncoming storm. It may be impossible, but there is still value in trying.

Dog Days are Over

Happiness hit her like a train on a track / coming towards her, stuck still, no turning back / she hid around corners and she hid under beds / she killed it with kisses and from it she fled

Slate and Gale are both somewhat estranged from happiness. So, when they start to form a bond with the other, they instinctively try to push it away. Slate because she knows that you can only be betrayed by those you trust, and Gale because he thinks himself a dead man walking.

Northern Attitude

If I get too close / and I’m not how you hoped / forgive my northern attitude / oh I was raised out in the cold /… oh I was raised on little light

Slate hasn’t had an easy life, and while she does like Gale, she worries that she is too damaged to be with him. This song is her begging him to forgive her for keeping her heart walled off from the world, trying to assure him that she does love him, even if she can’t say it.

First Light

The sky set to burst / the gold and the rust / the colour erupts /... the sun coming up / like I lived my whole life / before the first light

A classic of Gale playlists (thanks Tim!). Gale letting in the flood of light that Slate is for him, letting himself see colour again. In one sudden moment he is realising what it means to love somebody who brings warmth to him life (unlike somebody we could mention)

Hello My Old Heart

Hello, my old heart / it’s been so long / since I’ve given you away / and every day, I add another stone / to the walls I built around you / to keep you safe

Slate starts to deconstruct the walls around her heart, opening herself up to Gale, and allowing herself to be vulnerable to him. She still isn’t convinced that it won’t end with her brokenhearted, but she is starting to think that even if it all ends in tragedy, the happiness from the good parts will make it worth the pain.

Graceland Too

No longer a danger to herself or others / she made up her mind and laced up her shoes / yelled down the hall, but nobody answered / so she walked outside without an excuse

This song is about loving somebody who is self destructive and mentally ill. One one side, it depicts the suicidal path Gale is being pushed down by Mystra and Elminster. On the flip side, it depicts the struggle for Slate of loving somebody who is suicidal. Ultimately, Gale chooses to find a new path.

Has Anyone Ever Written Anything for You

Has anyone ever written anything for you? / in your darkest hours / have you ever heard me sing?

Gale to Slate. He knows the she hasn't had many people who have truly been on her side and there for her. Gale wants her to know that she is worthwhile, and that she is worthy of his love; that she deserves to have words and actions of love given to her.

Home to Me

How dare you love me like you never known fear?

Slate to Gale. This portrays Slate’s astonishment at how vulnerable Gale lets himself be. He seems to dive into their love without fear, despite the orb in his chest, despite the very real possibility of the world ending and their souls being destroyed. And despite all that, he is still choosing to love her rather than shutting out the potential of pain.

Something Just Like This

I’m not looking for somebody with some superhero gifts / some superhero / some fairy tale bliss / just something I can turn to / somebody I can kiss / I want something just like this

Slate doesn’t need Gale to be a god. She doesn’t need him to be Chosen. She doesn’t need him to be a powerful wizard. She only wants something just like this.

Inkpot Gods

And to those gods, I will speak bluntly / “we’ve an accord, if you ever touch or harm him / please rest assured that you might not fear a man / but to a woman, by the end, you’ll kneel and plea, ‘cause I’m more than what my mum told me to be”

An anthem to growing despite and overcoming trauma. As two highly traumatised people, Slate and Gale can’t fix mental illness with love, but they support each other, have the other’s back, and rejoice in recovery. Its also Slate's 'stay the fuck away Mystra' song.

Fair

He'll trip and she'll pretend not to have seen / Burying her head into his chest and clinging to the moment / "Where have you been?" she'll whisper/ "I've waited oh so long for you to come" / And as the stars above them hum and hear them / He'll turn to her and say, "That's what she said"

Slate and Gale travel to Waterdeep to start anew. Their love is strong and deep, and their bond has been tested time and time again. Yet, there is also beauty in the mundanity of love; in the everyday. This song has so many great lines it was hard to choose. I love how this song contrasts grand gestures of love (she promises to fight them all when it all becomes too much) and the day-to-day moments (you don’t need to pretend to be someone you’re not / ‘cause it’s not like I’ve never heard you fart and snore). Gale is a man of big, romantic gestures (conjure a beautiful starscape for your lover, intertwine your souls in the astral plane), but the everyday moments are just as beautiful and meaningful, and only become more so after Gale rejects godhood to remain mortal.

I do not have patience for "Gale wasn't groomed, and if you think he was you are just throwing around tiktok pseudopsychology buzzwords and refusing to acknowledge that Gale's story is about his ambition and hubris" discourse. That's an auto-block for me.

I'm happy to have a reasonable discussion as to whether or not what Gale experienced with Mystra was grooming in a sexual predator sense or merely a horribly unbalanced power dynamic between goddess and acolyte, but he was undeniably groomed for his role as Chosen in the "selected from a young age and trained for a particular position" sense. Elminster noticed his abilities and began training him when he was 8 years old. That's canon. He says as much his epilogue letter to Gale if Gale ascends. Everything in his life up until he got snatched up and tadpoled confirmed to him that he is only loveable if he is valuable or impressive, and that everything can be taken from him in an instant if he isn't constantly successful. A huge part of Gale's arc if you're romancing him and talk him down from ascending is him beginning to understand that he can be loved for who he is as a person regardless of his achievements and ambitions. Yes, he is arrogant. Yes, he is Icarian. But it's incredibly obtuse to ignore what information the game gives us about how his influences and mentors shaped him into who he is.

it's time for some more astarion analysis~

making this a separate post in case people wanted to reblog just the gifs on their own and don't care about the extra fluff. i'm certain this scene has been analyzed to the hells and back by this point, but when i was making this set something really stuck out to me and i wanted to throw my two cents in anyway.

this is the tail end of the mirror scene from act 1, where you catch astarion looking in the mirror and lamenting about not being able to see his reflection or knowing what he looks like anymore. and while that alone is sad enough, it gets SO MUCH WORSE.

if you express genuine interest in his predicament (i.e. asking him if he misses his reflection and what color his eyes were before he was turned), you get to see the mask slip. it's one of the first times in the game that he's not hiding behind his quick wit and silver tongue.

if you tell him you'll be his mirror, you can see the change in his demeanor immediately. his face softens, the cadence of his voice changes; you can literally hear the vulnerability in every word he says. huge props to neil and the rest of larian for making the distinction between these dialogue options, of course. it's the little details that really make moments like these shine.

but there was something else i noticed in the footage i recorded as well that i hadn't picked up on any of my other playthroughs. i've spent a lot of time staring at this man's face, especially while capturing idle animations for gifs and wallpapers, and most of the time it's what you'd expect, with minimal face movement, expressions changing, etc. most companions i record seem to behave the same way, with similar expressions/blinking/eye movement.

but just look at astarion's face here. this feels deliberately unique. he is SO anxious, so worried how you'll perceive him. the rapid blinking, the nervous darting of his eyes… it genuinely breaks my heart.

(tumblr will only let me upload one video per post, but just look at any other idle footage of him and you'll see the difference)

and the second you tell him what he thinks he wants to hear? that he's very attractive? he slips right back into his suave, flirtatious persona, and even praises you for complimenting his looks. even if you eventually ask him if all he wants is shallow praise, he still deflects and isn't completely honest with you.

note that if you choose to take the less compassionate route and simply tell them that he has a "very good face," he will still prompt you to tell him what you see when you look at him, and the delivery of the line is subtly but noticeably different and more guarded. similarly, if you poke a little too much fun at him by calling him old and draw too much attention to his mole, he gets very flustered and ends the conversation immediately. understandable, since he's relied on his appearance for so long, and hearing (even jokingly) that even that might not be something he can use anymore must be at least a little terrifying for him.

so naturally, you might think that by being truthful with him would perhaps net you a better result -- after all, you're telling him what he asked for, what you really see, that you see him as more than just someone to lust after -- but it doesn't. he actually seems a little upset if you choose those dialogue options. in that moment, he wants to know that you find him attractive, because he thinks that's all he's good for. because if you find him attractive, there's a chance that he could seduce you and use you for protection against cazador. i do think he also genuinely wants to know that there's so much more to him than just a pretty face, since that's a big theme of his entire story/romance arc, but that's not at the top of his priority list this early in the game. he's relying purely on instinct. he knows how to respond to people telling him he's attractive. accepting genuine compliments about the person beneath the mask? that's probably not something he's had much (if any) experience with in close to two centuries. he didn't have the luxury of being able to let anyone see who he really was.

all that to say that this interaction is really heartbreaking. he wants to be seen, wants to be understood and possibly loved, but at the same time he still thinks he needs to put on a front to ensure he can keep himself safe. watching him slowly start to unlearn those habits during the course of the game has been one of my favorite things about bg3 and a huge part of what's really endeared astarion to me as a character.

*dumps her random characterization and voice notes into your lap* here hope this helps

- Astarion speaks a little bit like a man removed from time and a little bit like an Upper City patriar, but not excessively so and not as a rule. Posh and embellished, but not completely avoidant of slang or casual swearing. Like a person who was once in a certain position in life, was ripped from it, and then spent a very long time in survival mode among people of lesser station/education. His mouth is often ahead of his brain. Many of his pricklier interactions are a direct result of trauma response. He longs to be in control, of his circumstances and of himself. His terms of endearment make subtle shifts from insincere and condescending to genuine and affectionate. When he feels threatened, he becomes distant and detached. He's funny, in both an awkward unintentional way and a very intentional witty way. He walks a razor's edge between a person who relies on his charms and an animal in a cage.

- Wyll is a deeply idealistic noble raised on tales of good knights and mighty heroes. His father was a soldier first, a noble second, and instilled in him a rigid moral code and high expectations for leadership. Those teachings led him to make a life-altering choice at seventeen years old that he was resoundly punished for due to manipulation and misunderstanding. Instead of becoming embittered, he cemented his dedication to his ideals and holds on to a sense of failure. He's eloquent and learned, with an abiding sense of chivalry and propriety. He's young, but not completely naive -- he has a firm personal code, but it's not immutable. Much of his conversation comes from stories he's heard or read that resonated with him. He is charismatic, friendly, and wants to believe in goodness. He's not above a cringe-worthy pun that he likely picked up from being around common folk.

- Lae'zel thinks non-githyanki beneath her, at least at first. Common is her second language and one she doesn't hold a lot of respect for -- she uses it to communicate and that's it. Her words are economic and blunt, but have a rich current of culture underneath. She is a soldier, but she is learned in the lore and ways of her people, and very proud of it. She does not deal in metaphor or hedging her opinions. She trusts her leadership and her queen implicitly. Her word is the truth (to her).

- Shadowheart is deeply mistrustful of people outside her cloister/belief system, which comes off as distance or aloofness. Her specific memories have been altered or removed, but all her core experiences and dedication remain. She's been raised in an environment that is very cult-like and spreads the idea that anyone unlike them is probably an enemy. Nothing is more important than proving herself to her parent-figure. Even so, she wants to connect. She wants to trust. Her communication is guarded and emotionally detached, until it isn't.

- Gale is extremely intelligent, but he's been removed from interacting with everyday people for a long time. His terminology tends to default to his book learning, which can come off as superiority. He has Gifted Kid Syndrome -- literally Chosen for his ability and knowledge, and experiencing a deep sense of, "Who am I if I'm not Chosen? What is my greater calling now?" He's used to his voice mattering, his expertise respected, but also internalized a sense of guilt and shame. He can err toward arrogance, but it comes from a place of wanting to make things better.

- Karlach was an Outer City street kid with what sounded like a reasonably happy home life and she ended up in the employ of a charming young entrepreneur who she completely trusted as hired muscle. That man betrayed her in an incredibly horrific way that she didn't see coming -- not because she's a fool, but because she wants to love people and he tricked her into loving him. She's spent a decade terribly lonely and literally untouchable by anyone but fire-immune fiends. She's cheery and optimistic, but it's largely a front to hide her hurt and sadness. Being a fighter is who she is, not only what she was forced to do. She believes her value is in her physical strength because she has no formal education or skills (she thinks). Her speech is casual, full of slang, blunt, crass, almost childlike (but she is NOT a child -- important distinction). There's a darkness in her she doesn't want to face, so she hides behind humor and affection. Still, when she loves, it is completely in earnest.