Commission For @manyfandomsonefan

Commission for @manyfandomsonefan

Spider is reborn as a Reef Na'vi

✨Click for better quality✨

After the RDA granted him the funds for his "personal project" – provided that the results would push along project Phoenix – Dr. R first experimented with existing Avatar technology. Using the prototype that would later develop into the Soul drive, he tried to infuse an empty body with her memories and personality. But whatever woke up in that tube wasn't his daughter. It came out wrong. It opened its eyes and screamed, thrashing around wildly. He had to get his colleague to help sedate it and put it back in the tube.

The first test was a failure. But Dr. R wasn't about to give up. He wiped her memories, modified the Soul drive prototype and tried again. This time it didn't scream, but crawled backwards, crying in fear. It didn't seem to recognise Dr. R at all. And so he did it again. And again. Over the years, as the body in the tube grew up, it was infused with the essence of Dr. R's daughter and then wiped hundreds of times until he got it right. Until the dead-eyed, smiling blue creature finally called him "papa". He took it around the lab, played games with it, taught it about Pandora, even took it for walks outside the base to breathe some fresh Pandoran air and unplugged it at bedtime. Or whenever he needed to stop one of its violent outbursts.

Dr. R's findings greatly contributed to project Phoenix, allowing the first Recoms to see the light of day, but he still wasn't happy. As much as he wanted to believe it, his experiments didn't really bring back his daughter. All he had was an alien in a tube that vaguely resembled her and could only recall memories he had painstakingly inserted into her mind. An alien that instantly turned into a limp, empty body whenever he unplugged the Soul drive prototype from the machine. Ironically, the RDA regarded this as a problem that needed to be fixed at first – it's why the first Recom squad had their memories transferred into their bodies permanently, rendering the Soul drives useless after the fact. But after seeing how that whole situation turned out, the RDA approached Dr. R again to develop a more versatile, controllable solution: the Plug'n'play project.

That night, when he went to unplug her, she didn't faint. She just shook her head. His colleagues later found him lying on the ground, unconscious, bleeding. The Soul drive prototype was gone, and so was she.

What do you think your blood au Quaritch thinks about Jeanniebug's weaving the web spider and quaritch respectively? How would he feel about ao3gobi's Quaritch or Spider? Like his thoughts and opinions on them if they were to ever meet? (Feel free to not answer if it makes you uncomfortable tho!)

I love thinking about the "Spider-verse" of all the different versions of Spider created through fanfic lol

So the version of Quaritch I created for Blood is Thicker Than Water (BiTTW-Quaritch) is definitely the most evil one, while @ao3gobi17 's Quaritch from Custody (C-Quaritch) is the nicest (relatively speaking) and then @jeanniebug623 's Quaritchs from her fics Silent as Shadows (SaS-Quaritch) and Weaving The Web (WTW-Quaritch) are the closest to canon Quaritch.

So for the Custody story, BiTTW-Quaritch would have some grudging respect for C-Quaritch for pulling off the jailbreak and hunting down Paz's killer, but he would also view him as way too soft on C-Spider. BiTTW-Quaritch would also dislike C-Spider the most out of all of the Spiders, because even though he's the most "civilized" and doesn't act as aggressive as the others, he's also the most cunning. C-Spider would be the hardest version of Spider for him to manipulate and he would HATE that!

A crossover with BiTTW and Custody would probably start with BiTTW-Quaritch and C-Quaritch getting along at first, but then BiTTW-Quaritch would slip up and threaten BiTTW-Spider in front of C-Quaritch. C-Quaritch isn't having any of that so he would probably just shoot BiTTW-Quaritch and take both Spiders with him lol. BiTTW-Spider would still want to go home to Pandora Island, but C-Quaritch wouldn't let him go so easily, especially if he heard about how he wasn't fully accepted by the Sullies. You'd think having two escape-artist teens to look after would make C-Quaritch's job harder, but actually having both of the Spiders together would make it harder for them to escape. BiTTW-Spider is super impulsive and aggressive while C-Spider is calmer and thinks through his escape attempts more. They would end up canceling each other out lol. BiTTW-Spider would screw up all of C-Spider's plans and C-Spider would shut down BiTTW-Spider's attempts at fighting his way out. BiTTW-Spider would also definitely expect C-Quaritch to hurt him after a failed escape attempt which I imagine would be very upsetting for C-Quaritch to deal with. I think if BiTTW-Spider was stuck with them for long enough, he might want to stay with C-Quaritch, but of course he would still help his "brother," C-Spider escape.

Now for Silent as Shadows and Weaving The Web, BiTTW-Quaritch would straight up hate those versions of Quaritch. Of course, he would be hella confused by an alternate version of himself where he's a giant blue alien, but once he learned that these Quaritchs were just clones made from the DNA of the "enemy," he would be disgusted by them and view them as inferior. BiTTW-Quaritch would idolize the "real" Quaritch who died fighting Jake in A1 and try to follow what he believes he would want. He would also "like" SaS-Spider more than the others, because he sees the value of using him as a translator and guide. He would want to get him away from Sas-Quaritch so he could break him down and turn him into a soldier like he did to BiTTW-Spider. Same thing for WTW-Spider, but he would view that version as more of a liability due to his mental illness. With WTW-Spider, he would probably focus less on using him in the field, and focus more on getting intel out of him.

A crossover with SaS would end with BiTTW-Quaritch trying to kill Sas-Quaritch and kidnap SaS-Spider to brainwash him and complete the "real" Quaritch's mission." But I think between Reyka and SaS-Quaritch, he's not going to get away with it, and he would end up dead and the others would take BiTTW-Spider. Reyka would be just heartbroken to see a version of Spider that has been hurt and abused so much and she would try to comfort him, though BiTTW-Spider would be confused by why this giant cat woman likes him so much lol. I also have this idea that SaS-Quaritch would see how abusive BiTTW-Quaritch is and have a moment of seeing his own bad behavior reflected back at himself and realize he needs to be a better father for his son, and for this weird traumatized alternate version of his son. Unlike the Custody crossover, SaS-Spider and BiTTW-Spider would get along much better, and SaS-Spider would teach his new "brother" all about Pandora, and BiTTW-Spider would tell him about Pandora Island. They would have a fun time comparing the Na'vi and human versions of their friends. I think in this version, SaS-Quaritch wouldn't try to keep BiTTW-Spider against his will and would try to find a way to send him back home, but SaS-Spider would miss him and want him to stay longer. The two Spiders would definitely conspire to escape together with Reyka so they can introduce BiTTW-Spider to the blue versions of his friends.

A Weaving the Web crossover would probably go pretty much the same way minus Reyka. And i think BiTTW-Spider would talk about his dissociative episodes and WTW-Spider would talk about his dissociative identity disorder and support each other.

Man, this was fun to think about! Great ask!

@nilnether that's a great analysis, and actually I think that may be a better explanation for why so many people found Spider off-putting. He absolutely does break the fantasy. Back before I deleted tiktok, I remember seeing so many people talking about how they hated him for being annoying and trying to insert himself into the Na'vi world, and those same people would have self-insert Na'vi characters. They hated him even though they fantasized about the exact same thing he's trying to do. He's a reminder that only the lucky few like Jake get to actually immerse themselves in Pandora, and the majority of people are stuck as humans. By extension, he's a reminder that Pandora itself is just a fantasy.

And yeah definitely wouldn't have wanted any racism added into the mix. I'm just glad that the Avatar fandom is so small that Jack Champion and other actors can't be harmed by fans. It would break my heart to see the Avatar cast get treated like some Star Wars actors were treated by their fans...

Do you have any thoughts on the fact that in first scenario Spider was supposed be from Mexico and his name was Javier?

I don't think we ever had any real confirmation of original-Spider's ethnicity or nationality, but when his name was first announced as "Javier Socorro" a lot of people assumed he would be Latino Hispanic (from a Latin American country) instead of White Hispanic (from Spain) like he ended up being. That meant he very well could've been Mexican, or at least half-Mexican on his mom's side since I think he was always intended to be Quaritch's son. I believe they changed his first name to "Miles" to make the connection to Quaritch more obvious.

If Spider had been Mexican, it wouldn't have really changed anything in The Way of Water. He's still a human, and being a different color wouldn't change the way the other characters perceive him. The only thing that would've been different is that he wouldn't have had the nickname "monkey boy/monkey mascot," since having Sigourney Weaver and Stephen Lang calling a Hispanic kid monkey would NOT have gone over well.

Even though making him a different ethnicity wouldn't have changed the movie itself, I actually think it might've changed the way he was perceived by the audience.

This is a thought I've had in the back of my head for a long time, and this question finally gave me a reason to type it all out. But before I get into it, I do want to say that I am white and American, so I'm speaking from the perspective of a white American when I make this analysis of Spider's character and how he was perceived by American audiences. Now let's get into it:

Spider was a pretty controversial character. A lot of people hated him, but there was also a minority of people who really loved him too (me lol). Some people hated him because they felt like Neteyam's death was his fault or because they didn't like that he saved Quaritch in the end, which are reasons that wouldn't change because of his ethnicity, but there were also people who hated him because of his appearance. Spider was often described as "feeling out of place" and off-putting to some viewers. After I saw the Way of Water with my cousins, one of them (he is also white) told me that he hated Spider. When I asked him why, he shrugged and said, "he's a white boy with dreadlocks!" like that was the only reason he needed.

Now I'm just speculating here, but I think a small part of the reason why so many people can't stand Spider might be because he is white. Not because of racism against white people, but because of the context in which Spider exists as a white person. The Na'vi are very obvious allegories for indigenous American, African, and Maori people, and the RDA is a very obvious allegory for European colonizers and US corporations that exploited those groups. I can't speak for the rest of the world, but in America there are social controversies over white American people taking items that are culturally significant to other groups and wearing them as costumes. I know there's a lot of controversy over what is and isn't cultural appropriation, but when it comes to specifically white people wearing specifically Native American clothing, it's generally regarded negatively since most Native American people have said it's disrespectful because the clothing has cultural and spiritual significance.

And then we have Spider, who is not only white, but is also the son of two people who actively harmed the Na'vi, and he wears Na'vi clothing.

In the context of the Avatar movies, it makes perfect sense that Spider would dress and act the way that he does. He was raised alongside the Na'vi so it's all he knows. If you were going to fit Spider into the greater allegory of Avatar, he is similar to the historical figure, Olive Oatman. When Oatman was a child in the 1800s, her family was killed by a group of Native Americans, and she and her sister ended up being taken in by the Mohave people. She lived with them for several years before returning to a white settlement, and during that time she was assimilated into the Mohave tribe, wearing their clothing and receiving traditional tattoos. (Her story is super interesting, you should totally read more about it!). Spider is like a sci-fi version of Oatman, since his parents were killed by natives and he ended up being taken in by them and assimilating into their culture. In the context of modern day culture, a white woman getting Mohave tattoos would be considered appropriation, but in the context of Oatman's situation, it makes sense. Same thing with Spider. In-universe, adopting Omaticaya culture makes sense.

However, if you look at Spider through the lens of modern American cultural context, he looks an awful lot like a white kid dressing up in the traditional clothing of a culture his people harmed. If Spider had been raised on earth and was actively benefiting from the RDA's exploitation of Pandora, then what he's doing would be considered appropriation. But he wasn't. Even though that's not what Spider is, the association is still there. So when people see this "white boy with dreadlocks" as my cousin put it, they feel like there's something wrong with what they're looking at because they associate his appearance with cultural appropriation. I think if Spider had been cast as Latino, he might have been received a bit more favorably by the audience.

Once again, this is all just speculation, I don't really know if Spider's perception would've been different if he'd been a different ethnicity, and I acknowledge that most of the hate Spider received had to do with his character actions. However, I do believe that American audiences may have been partly influenced by the concept of cultural appropriation, which is where that feeling of Spider being "off-putting" comes from. I think it's definitely where my cousin's dislike of him comes from, since it's not about anything he did, but rather how he looks like.

The moment from the leaked script is absolutely what I'm most excited to see! Not only because of the effect it will have on Spider, but also how it will change Jake and Quaritch's dynamic. Seeing them go from trying to kill each other to having a civil conversation while their children sleep will be very interesting to see. And I agree that I kind of want Quaritch to think Spider actually died, just so he can get a taste of his own medicine!

Keeping it together

This is going to contain SPOILERS for Avatar 3 as I'm speculating based on leaks

So, I can't stop thinking what must've been happening as Spider gets his ability to breathe Pandoran air.

Just imagine it. There's Jake, Kiri, Spider and probably also Lo'ak and/or Tuk (it says later Neytiri embraces her kids plural and Tuk run to grandma when they land so maybe they are even all there). And then there is Quaritch who just recently tried to kill them but, even more recently, helped them escape Ash Na'vi. They've just been in a pretty bad fight and now Spider is suffocating in front of them.

The kids just lost a brother and now another person they love is dying and they can't do anything. Quaritch only came along for him, dropped everything and allied himself with his worst enemy and he's about to lose Spider. They are all already freaking out and that's without thinking what Quaritch will do when Spider is gone.

And then there is Jake, in the middle of this chaos, who has to keep it together for the kids and in case Quaritch gets violent, so he just can't freak out that Spider is dying just like he himself almost died. Suffocating to death is not fun and here's a kid reliving his nightmares. And to add to that whole thing he also basically has to console a version of a man that did that to him on purpose (not that this one remembers). Keeping it all together like a big, damn hero he is.

And then when Kiri does her magic Jake probably has to keep Quaritch from disturbing it (imagine your dying kid was being swallowed by glowing roots or whatever that will look like). It just feels like Quaritch would panic even more seeing it happen. Everyone else believes Eywa could save Spider but he has no clue.

I hope that at least Spider gets to lose consciousness and then wake up and just be like good with the air thing. It'd be nice if Quaritch was the one who gets all the emotional damage. I'm all for Quaritch going through all the pain of losing a kid, thinking Spider had died, if Spider is actually just fine the whole time. Imagine Spider just wakes up and sees Quaritch all wailing and is like "WTF, who died?" (Kiri is secretly smirking as she made it look a bit scarier on purpose because she knew Quaritch cares and it wouldn't hurt anyone but him. OK this part is just my wishful thinking.)

No wonder kids collapse and Jake and Quaritch can have a normal talk. After all of that who would have emotional capacity for any more conflict.

Quaritch, Jake, and Spider in Avatar 3