The Thing Is, There Is Room For A Great Deal Of That And It Could Be Utterly Amazing If - If You Gave

The thing is, there is room for a great deal of that and it could be utterly amazing if - if you gave it to an excellent writing team.

As an example the Roman Emperor Domitianus is often regarded as one of Rome’s bad tyrannical emperors. Tacitus in particular paints him as an incompetent man, jealous of his servants great successes. He is accused of fabricating triumphs and wasting roman lives in unsuccessful wars. Thing is, he was extremely popular with the army and when Trajan began his Dacian Wars a lot of the necessary infrastructure was in place, put there in large part by Domitianus who also campaigned in the area, even though less successfully. Regarding his tyrannicsl nature, none of his reforms that were seen as tyrannical were ever reversed by his successors but only Domitianus ever caught any flac for it. Pliny remarks on his the ascension of Trajan to the imperial throne that he is so happy too never again have a princeps that he has to call dominus. Guess what he called Trajan in all his letters.

You could absolutely make a show about how Maegor and Jaehaerys ultimately shared many of the same ideas and values but one was very good at making them palatable to the Westeros-edition of the patriarchy and the other was murdered and labeled the worst Tyrant in history.

But again, you‘d need goid writers and the track record thus far does not inspire much confidence

HOTD and the future shows

Wanna know what I am fearing, in light of how the second season of HOTD have proved to be?

The future series based on the Tales of Dunk and Egg... if a show based on the Dance of Dragons-era/generations in Fire and Blood, can become so changed from the source material, how will things go for Egg aka future Aegon V in his boyhood, and Dunk, the future Lord Commander of the Kingsguard, in how their plotline will be handed?

In fact, one worry of mine, when thinking about all of this, is how a TV show based on the reign of Maegor the Cruel would end like, based on what HOTD have done as "supposed" changes to the plot and characters.

I know that Classical Disney Movies may sound odd as a way to describe Maglor the Cruel, but I am thinking of the hand-drawn Original Disney Classics and the ongoing trend of making them into Live-Action versions:

Say that Maegor the Cruel as he is written in Fire and Blood, as well the other published books so far, is akin to a such Classic Disney movie, and how not all the Live-Action movies based on the Classics have proved to be....let's say well received, by fans.

If the second season of HOTD have proved to not be well received by fans for various reasons, then how well would a TV show based on Maegor do? Would the tv team try and paint his cruelity as "propaganda written by the Maesters/his enemies" to make Jaehaerys come off as a much better King? Would they rewrite his personality to 180 degrees, akin to how Season 2-Alicent is NOTHING compared to her book self? Would they try and make up something "tragic" about his relationships to his six wives, going for the far too common "All girls want bad boys" idea and that Maegor only "need" someone to see his "supposed real" self akin to Beauty and the Beast?

I am sorry for babbling, but if this mess of a second season is the result of trying to make a tv show out of Fire and Blood so far....

Then I am in honest doubt that the 2025 tv show about Dunk and Egg is not gonna live up to the original written tales of them.

And I can see Maegor's character in a possible TV show be haunted by cries from fans in style of "he is not like that in Fire and Blood!" "When did someone called the "Cruel" in-story suddenly become a "misunderstood" character like this?" "He is called the Cruel, not the "poor, second son" of Aegon the Conqueror!"

I sat down to write my reaction post to the second ep of HOTD and…realized Idk how to approach it, where to start. And not because I hated every single thing about it – like with ep1 there were lots of good or at least interesting moments. There were other choices I wouldn’t have personally liked in any circumstance but that weren’t necessarily bad in and of themselves if they’d been in another show, surrounded with other context or other scenes. The problem is how ridiculously biased this writing is and how that bias and the ridiculousness of it permeates everything, even the parts that were good or fine or reasonably in character. We knew, of course, even from S1, that the writing was biased. But this season it feels especially blatant.

How am I supposed to feel about say…Jae’s funeral? On one hand, a gut-wrenching scene, carried so well by Olivia and Phia’s superb understated acting. It’s a scene that has every reason to be there – royal funeral processions/spectacles were (and still are) normal. And even if it’s not a regular occurrence in this universe (questionable), it’s a very good and smart play by Otto. On the other hand, is it not suspect that the funeral of this child was less of a melancholy moment of mourning like Luke’s funeral (despite the obviously grieving family) but focused on Helaena’s panic attack at being too close to too many people, and with the distraction of Jae’s cart getting stuck in the mud (was that supposed to be symbolic of something???). Do we not remember TB shrieking long before the episode aired that the Greens have a public funeral for Jae “just to make the Greens look bad”? These people are known for the worst faith takes, so what does it say that the writers apparently agree with them?

How am I supposed to feel about Alicent’s inability to successfully, if at all, to comfort her children? Is this a potentially interesting exploration of how her own grief, guilt, self-blame/low self-esteem, and complicated relationship with her kids due to their common and individual family traumas (and, in Helaena’s case…neurodivergence, I guess?) have and are affecting her? Or is it just a low-key attempt at character assassination, given that last season she was shown as perfectly capable of showing affection to her children (more than one with Aemond, hugging Helaena and making other attempts when she was less receptive, even kissing Aegon at the coronation despite their turbulent relationship)?

Is Alicent’s self-blame and guilt a potentially interesting exploration of how grief can affect people, of what happens when a person feels they are breaking some moral or ethical or religious code of conduct that they sincerely believe in/believe they can be punished for breaking? Or does the narrative blame her too/knows that a large chunk of the audience will too or at least will find the self-blame and guilt pathetic or unsympathetic (because goodness knows that’s all Twitter/X has to say on the matter, it seems).

How am I supposed to feel about Aegon hanging the ratcatchers? Of course, Otto is right – this was a terrible thing to do, not just because it was politically a misstep, but first of all because there were many innocent people executed without trial. It’s a canonical event, and in context of Aegon’s grief and fury, it’s interesting in and of itself, it’s part of the commentary on the wreckage that war and nobles’ games cause. I’d have no issue with it, except…. Why was this made into a literal cartoon-villain-esque kick the dog moment? By making me feel sorry for the sad, cute puppy am I supposed to think that hanging Cheese was somehow wrong? After he sawed off a child’s head? And why is it that the smallfolk get angry when Aegon hands the ratcatchers but not when Rhaenys trembles dozens of smallfolk in the dragon pit? How come Aegon is held accountable for all his mistakes, at least by the people closest to him, and Criston very specifically sends a kingsguard member to impersonate his twin and kill Rhaenyra, but the show removed maximum responsibility from Daemon and of course made sure that Rhaenya was just appalled by the whole thing. (And suddenly cares about Helaena? I actually rolled my eyes at that line so hard it hurt.)

What am I to think of the messy/awkward/complicated TG family dynamics? They’re interesting! They’re fun! They could make for some great television (and fic lol). I could/should/would enjoy this. But on the other hand, when TB get all these bonding moments, or the potential messiness (e.g. Rhaena feeling ignored by her father) is ignored in like 85% of situations? And when this imbalance is not at all in the book? (When it feels like they wanted to cut/held off on Daeron specifically because he was so sweet and mild tempered and beloved by everyone?) It becomes frustrating, not fun.

At what point do I need to decide that this show isn’t worth it? After all, I think the sentiment that “maybe this is just not telling the kind of story you want to hear/watch” is generally a wise approach. Except…that would hold if this was an original show or if it was one of those “loosely based on/inspired by” things that were not pretending to be adaptations. But when you’re advertised an adaptation, you’re not coming in blind. Ideally, you’re coming in knowing what sort of story you’re coming for, at the very least. Unlike  ASOIAF, the Dance is a fully finished story. There shouldn’t have been any “nasty surprises” like some people got in the last seasons in GoT…

But they mentioned Daeron by name. Tom’s acting is incredible. We know I’m not going anywhere for now lmao.

Maybe I won’t do my usual type of notes/reaction post this time, after all I’ve said so much of what I most feel right now anyway.

Sorry for the depression/pessimism guys. I’m just so tired.

I am continuously perplexed at how a show as objectively bad and problematic as hotd keeps inspiring outstanding fanfics like yours and @gwenllian-in-the-abbey’s. Truly it’s a mystery to me, especially considering that the books covering the dance are supposed to be quite mediocre as well from what I’ve perceived. Just so you know,with that trailer out now I’m gonna completely blend out the events of the show and consider our fathers clad in red canon

@gwenllian-in-the-abbey AAAAAAAAAAAAAA, I think George's gonna order a hit on us:D

I'm glad you like our slightly destructive approach to teh canon. I'm mostly fueled by spite and my dislike for George's and HBO's complete disregard for the historical context of the stuff they draw their inspiration from (you can't do the Matilda vs Stephen showdown and expect the same sense of injustice, when your main conflict is about Viserys' imbecilic approach to rules, Rhaenyra's weak-ass claim and papa/dragons being her go-to solution to all her problems, Daemon being a chaos gremlin, Corlys' malignant ambition and the Hightowers being the only ones who actually care about the rule of law.)

A lesbian romance doesn't automatically turn a story into a feminist manifesto, nor does a girlboss who's treated by the narrative as the second coming of Christ. Context matters and it's a mistake to view the Dance through the lens of modern ideals about egalitarianism.

GRRM's hubris when it comes to "Aragorn's tax policies" is just another thing that enrages me and Gwenllian, because the man completely misunderstands the medieval legal codes. Just because they were complex that doesn't mean they were fucking contradictory on their own; no one wanted civil wars breaking out each time a monarch died.

Problems happened when two countries with generational beefs worked on two different principles of succession, ie. England (male-preference primogeniture) vs France (male-only primogeniture), or if there was some dynastic fuckery that completely messed up the clear-cut succession lines with usurpations and cousin marriages (Yorks vs Lancasters).

Had Richard II (the son of the Black Prince) died peacefully without issue, the succession would have followed through the line of the Duke of Clarence, with Edmund the Earl of March eventually becoming the king (and he was Richard's heir, btw).

But that's not what happened. The son of John of Gaunt usurped the throne and it was then passed down through his line, because he was the crowned king. Now, you can argue whether or not he had any right to do the usurpation in the first place and whether or not he was the legitimate king and you bet people back then argued about that too. This ambiguity is how you create a proper narrative about actually conflicting claims. The only thing propping up Rhaenyra against her brother is the fact that Viserys is a moron.

How the fuck can I take F&B seriously and without the Dead Sea's worth of salt, when it pretty much blows Jaehaerys' posthumous dick about his wisdom when he "let" the council of 101 decide the succession (while politely ignoring the fact that Jaehaerys' own claim is legit only in the cases of either full salic or semi-salic succession, ie male-only), while never once it calls out Viserys out on his extremely dangerous decision. He gets to die venerated as the peaceful grandpa and all the blame for his incompetence is piled on Aegon II and Alicent.

Let's go through the possible succession systems, shall we?

If we follow male-preference primogeniture, the legitimate line of kings ends with Aerea because she was the eldest child of Aegon the Uncrowned, Maegor's eldest nephew. Only after she and her sister die without issue, Jaehaerys can become the king. Jaehaerys' canon ascension works only because Rhaena gave up her daughters' claims. The next in line would be Aemon and after him Rhaenys. But that's not what happened.

If we follow the salic law (male only), the legitimate line of the kings goes Aegon I -> Aenys I -> Aegon Uncrowned -> Jaehaerys I -> Viserys I -> Aegon II. This is probably what Jaehaerys wanted to ensure, since he challenged Maegor's kingship in the first place.

If a crowned king can choose his heir, then Jaehaerys was never a legitimate king and Aerea was the true queen, because Maegor, who had won his crown in the trial by combat, chose her as his heir.

What about the principle of seniority? Cognatic seniority where men and women have equal claims is out of the question since Aegon I was the crowned king, not Visenya. Male-only seniority would go Aegon I -> Aenys I -> Maegor I (uncontested!) -> Aegon Crowned This Time -> Viserys the Not Tortured to Death -> Jaehaerys I -> Aemon (only if his uncle Viserys has no issue) -> Baelon -> Vaegon -> Viserys I -> Daemon (EW).

Notice the distinct lack of Rhaenyra.

Team Black keeps mentioning the widow's law, but that's a bulk of nonsense. I suppose the misunderstanding originates from a (willful) misinterpretation of this passage. The book says:

Now, I highly doubt Jaehaerys intended for the law to mean that a daughter from the first marriage should come before the sons from the second. The wording is a bit unlucky, but I suppose the intention was to establish the legal position of the second wife and her children as united with the position of her step-children - she has the same duties towards them as if they were own, and the same goes the other way. Which would make sense. Because otherwise, no one would be desperate enough to marry a widower with daughters. Since we know that title and land ownerships have remained in the same families without changing hands once or twice since the implementation of the law, I really doubt the team black's literal interpretation of the passage was the one intended. Ffs, Viserys was pushed to marry again because he had only one daughter, meaning, this law wasn't viewed the way the Team Black wishes for. And I'm not even delving into the fact that this would be a female inheritance hack penned by Jaehaerys, if that was the case. Talk about ooc.

So, yeah, we're taking Gyldayne's interpretation of the past with so much salt our hearts are gonna fail.

Reblog this if you support sex-averse and sex-repulsed aces, including:

Aces who never want to have sex

Aces who had sex in the past but don't desire it anymore

Aces with sexual trauma who feel like their trauma ties into their asexuality

Aces with sexual trauma who don't feel like their trauma caused their asexuality

Aces who don't want to talk to you about sex

Aces who don't want to hear about sex

Yes even aces who do not want to engage with any sexual content and don't want it in their own personal spaces

Yes even aces who express the desire to have more spaces for queer adults where their boundaries are met (on top of the queer spaces that exist, we do not want to sanitize your existing spaces ffs)

If you cannot be normal about these people existing, if you believe they're a threat to our community and to how we're viewed by people who aren't aspec and the rest of the LGBTQ+ community, you are not an asexual ally. Yes, even if you're aspec yourself. Especially if you're aspec yourself.

Because it's been pride month for 4 days and I'm already seeing people trying to throw us under the bus or pretend we don't exist because that makes the ace community more palatable to exclusionists and people who swallowed too much "aces are puritans" propaganda.

Alicent's New Bedroom: Book vs Show and Impact on Blood and Cheese

This is the Red Keep. It's made up of distinct towers and structures.

Maegor's Holdfast is the place of the royal residence, where the king's apartments are located. This is where the king and/or queen and their immediate household. It has unique characteristics:

"The royal apartments were in Maegor's Holdfast, a massive square fortress that nestled in the heart of the Red Keep behind walls twelve feet thick and a dry moat lined with iron spikes, a castle-with-a-castle. Ser Boros Blount guarded the far end of the bridge, white steel armor ghostly in the moonlight" (p. 502, Edward XIII, A Game of Thrones).

Well-designed and well-guarded, not even a rat catcher in the castle knows of a hidden way in or out of Maegor's Holdfast:

"The hidden doors and secret tunnels that Maegor the Cruel had built were as familiar to the rat catcher as to the rats he hunted. Using a forgotten pssageway, Cheese led Blood into the heart of the castle, unseen by guard. Some say their quarry was the king himself, but Aegon was accompanied by Kingsguard wherever he went and even Cheese knew of no way in and out of Maegor's Holdfast save the drawbridge that spanned the dry moat and it's formidable spikes" (p. 424, The Dying of the Dragons - A Son for a Son, Fire and Blood).

This is the most secure location within the Red Keep itself, which is why the royal family lives there. It is a large space with many rooms, including the Queen's Ballroom. In season one of House of the Dragon, Viserys lives in the king's apartments with his wives and there are many bedrooms where members of the royal household and their household staff live. After Alicent marries Viserys, she moves from the Tower of the Hand where she lived with her father to the king's apartment in Maegor's Holdfast and lives there until Viserys' death.

Separate from Maegor's Holdfast is the Tower of the Hand, where the Hand of the King and his family live. The tower contains many rooms, including the bedchamber of the Hand of the King, rooms for his household, and the Small Hall. There are guards in the Tower of the Hand, but there were those who were familiar with its hidden doorways and secret tunnels:

"Any man of normal size would have had to crawl on hands and knees, but Tyrion was short enough to walk upright [...] He came to the third door and fumbled about for a long time before his fingers brushed a small iron hook set between two stones. When he pulled down on it, there was a soft rumble that sounded loud as an avalanche in the stillness, and a square dull orange light opened a foot to his left. The hearth! He almost laughed [...] When he found himself in what had been once his bedchamber, he stood for a long moment" (p. 1070, Tyrion XI, A Storm of Swords).

After Aegon is crowned, he, Helaena, and their young children move into the king's apartments in Maegor's Holdfast, so the Dowager Queen, Alicent moves out. But where does she move to? In Fire and Blood, Alicent moves back into the Tower of the Hand, where she lived as a child with her father. It's because of this move to the Tower of the Hand specifically that Blood and Cheese have the opportunity to access Aegon's sons. Every night, Helaena and her kids would leave Maegor's Holdfast to go to the Tower of the Hand and visit Alicent before bed, which allowed Blood and Cheese to plan their ambush. Despite Helaena having a guard and the presence of guards throughout the Tower of the Hand and the Red Keep itself, Alicent's new bedchamber and its secret passageways have Blood and Cheese a chance to sneak in and make their move:

"The Tower of the Hand was less secure. The two men crept up through the walls, bypassing the spearman posted at the tower doors. Ser Otto's rooms were of no interest to them. Instead they slipped into his daughter's chambers, one floor below [...] Once inside, Cheese bound and gagged the Dowager Queen whilst Blood strangled her beadmaid. Then they settled down to wait, for they knew that it was the custom of Queen Helaena to bring her children to see their grandmother every evening before bed [...] Blood barred the door and slew the Queen's guardsman, while Cheese appeared to snatch up Maelor" p. 424, The Dying of the Dragons - A Son for a Son, Fire and Blood).

House of the Dragon, however, decided to make some major changes to the event of Blood and Cheese. In HOTD season 2, Queen Alicent doesn't move out of Maegor's Holdfast, and and instead, despite having choice of several different bedrooms, decides to move into the specific room where Rhaenyra lived up until episode 6 of season one.

The show previously added a tunnel from Rhaenyra's old room to the outside of the Red Keep in season one. However, instead of using that connection to have Blood and Cheese surprise Alicent in her room as they did in the book, they instead use a tunnel to sneak into the Red Keep. They then proceed to walk through large portions of the Red Keep, including the throne room, eventually walking right into Maegor's Holdfast, all the while unchecked by any servants or guards. They walk right into the king's apartments where the unguarded Helaena is with her sleeping children. Once Blood begins killing Jaehaerys, Helaena carries Jaehaera through empty hallways to Alicent's room where she walks in on Alicent and Criston.

Why the changes from the book? A few possibilities:

1) The show made the change because they write the characters of Alicent and Criston as intrinsically linked to Rhaenyra, so they wanted to make a point of showing them have sex in her old room, in order to make them both hypocritical, something that could only likely happen if Alicent lived there. Placing this scene at the end of the Blood and Cheese sequence adds an extra shock element for viewers. Removing Alicent's presence during Blood and Cheese and giving her a sex scene during the event instead viewers to focus on her "hypocrisy" as well as point the blame and outrage towards her and away from the true culprit. Additionally, the show doesn't have to include a scene where the Greens act like the family they are.

2) The show made the change of hallways being empty of servants and guards, as well as personal guards being absent from members of the royal family, to show viewers that the Greens have somehow become incompetent almost overnight when it comes to household security, despite having lived in the Red Keep for the last several years and effectively ruling the kingdoms in Viserys' stead. This diverts blame away from the Blacks and toward the Greens, as they should have been protecting themselves. Specifically, the blame is in on Criston Cole for not having guards posted (there's no real explanation for why he did not have them posted).

3) The show made the change because they wanted to film a one shot of Helaena and her baby walking through Maegor's Holdfast to call back to Rhaenyra's walk through the same hallways with her newborn in season 1 episode 6 because everything comes back to Rhaenyra in this show and they wanted viewers to connect the two events for whatever reason.

Among other changes to Blood and Cheese, it seems to me that the show ultimately changed these aspects of the event in order to minimize the event itself and shift the blame.

Wait what's a buildings fire evacuation plan if you aren't supposed to use the elevator to get down