Book Adaptations - Tumblr Posts
I greatly think, as I've seen it come up time and again whenever this game is brought up, is people becoming interested in JttW. I'm positive you got more traffic since this game was released, cause people want to know what it's based on.
Something called a "Conspiracy Theory" does not invite any sense of truth… But I also do not see what it has to do with BMW. Or what you mean by "The game follows this method." I don't know; maybe it flew over my head, but it doesn't seem like your most informed takes, which surprises me with all the research you do, and I usually like your articles.
I won't mention Does the Buddha Lie in Journey to the West? Too much because it doesn't involve in the overall argument I will present about adaptations in general (maybe I should reblog the response post, but this all started because of this post, so), but for the sake of responding to this post… I don't have any issue with your response to Ye Zhiqiu. I find it the most reasonable thing presented to me out of everything connected to this post and another good article by you, though a part of me wants to read his article directly; however, I am unable to read the language, and online translation can involve some level of incorrectness.
Anyways, more is below. It, uh, got long. I'm sorry if this possibly comes off as rude, I say this as I do have some struggles with identifying emotion and text especially makes it harder.
I just read the post from Ryin-Silverfish, so I will put my immediate thoughts on it. It talked a lot about JCT but little about the game. In addition, how they explained JCT makes me see it even less... Tho, I find it weird that they call out A Chinese Odyssey, considering that's a drama-comedy and most things are done for humor effect rather than a commentary (not that there isn't any; I feel that it is impossible for someone's view/beliefs to not color a work to a degree)--I do not want to say 'reading too much into it' because I don't think that can be true of anything. Still, I feel it's a bit 'watching with an altered view of it.' I have seen the first two parts, and unfortunately, part 3.
A point I've seen in that post and here <https://www.tumblr.com/journeytothewestresearch/762214744615763968/ive-read-your-articles-on-your-blog-i-cant?source=share> is that BMW makes all gods evil, which I would disagree with. Erlang, for all that he was involved in, is not evil as he helps Wukong (even yearning for him at times, ngl that was a... charged battle). I would even argue the Demon Bull family wasn't evil or the Spider family. So on that point, the JCT-BMW theory is just a theory.
Edit: some time after making this post I've seen the true ending, and also an interesting video by Jaobird (Black Myth: Wukong is Actually Insane - Before You Buy Black Myth: Wukong) that talks about his experience and feelings. Something he mentions is the lore entries, how in-depth they are, and the large amount of them, and I think that points to the idea that the developers cared more than some people think. The animations at the end of each chapter I think points to this too. I cannot comment, however, on anything about "distort the meaning of Buddhahood or Enlightenment", though I can see an interpretation both ways of yes or no, because of me being rather new to learning these things and not living in an area with any form of Buddhism so no exposure growing up past knowing that Buddhism is a thing.
And regarding your earlier response about adaptations in that post, this will be rude, but get over yourself. This is honestly spiraling too much, but I think it clouds your view and overwrites your better judgment of any work based on JttW, which you admit to somewhat. You cannot properly analyze BMW with this view that "In general, I don't like adaptations," as it will automatically put BMW in a negative light for you and make you more negative than critical before even looking at the game itself.
Adaptations can be good; whether or not BMW does it is another argument, but disregarding something because it's an adaptation (not even about how it adapts the thing) is just a closed view of it.
Mind you, I've only seen up to the 5th chapter (edit: now true ending) and haven't read the lore entries and such, so I'm not speaking as a BMW fan or anything--for what I've seen so far, it's alright--or as someone particularly knowledgable about it. I'm speaking more from my experiences with mythologies or historical figures adapted to various works. Such as the Greek gods or Arthurian media, even something like Peter Pan. And my research into what makes an adaptation... and my deep dive into as many adaptations of the JttW as possible; what can I say? I have fun with them. (Except for Conquering the Demons, that was a bad movie).
Adaptations are more than just taking the book and making it another medium, keeping 100% as is, despite the common definition or what many people think. To take from Oxford, an adaptation is "the process of making a work of art upon the basis of elements provided by an earlier work in a different, usually literary, medium." And "distinctions are commonly drawn between ‘faithful’ adaptations, in which the distinctive elements (characters, settings, plot events, dialogue) of the original work are preserved as far as the new medium allows, and ‘free’ adaptations, sometimes called ‘versions’ or ‘interpretations,’ in which significant elements of the original work are omitted or replaced by wholly new material."
There will be changes because how people view and/or understand a particular concept changes over time; the whole joke about "historians will call them friends" comes from historians hesitant to put any label on people because how homosexuality was understood has changed over time (from the view of the people then and the historian of any particular era afterward).
Maybe someone wants to "adapt" it to their modern era (whenever that is) and/or change the allegory. Maybe it's JttW, but its setting is changed to 1920s Germany, or the allegory for heaven is changed from 16th-century China and the criticism of it, changed to 20th-century America and the criticism of it. [You definitely see this with Arthurian literature and other mediums, which are constantly adapting on itself, most often Le Morte D'Arthur, or changing the allegory such as Arthur the good chivalrous king vs Arthur the lazy bum look at our original oc Lancelot (I like Lancelot but). Does this make, say, BBC Merlin a bad show cause it changed Merlin into a servant boy who secretly had magic? No, it's a lousy show cause it kept fumbling on how to tell its story and holding back on revealing that Merlin had magic to Arthur until Arthur died was highly dumb.] Nezha Reborn is a damn good movie, even though it involves Nezha dying and Wukong being the cooky old fool and is set in a different time period entirely--it is still an adaptation, and it isn't 100% faithful to JttW or Investiture of the Gods in the case of Nezha.
Sometimes, though, the original work would not work 100% faithfully in another medium--musicals come to mind. I doubt a musical could be entirely faithful to the novel because the time it would take for a musical would be outlandish and unrealistic to do, things would have to be cut out or altered.
To go even further, dipping into slightly extreme, but what about fanart? Art on its own is adapting the work. Is it not worth looking at if someone puts Sun Wukong in modern clothing? Or interpret Tripitaka as something other than a monk?
Is creative expression not allowed? Because it's an adaptation?
I wanted to add something someone on Discord said to me about adaptations. "Adaptations have been a thing basically as long as we’ve had two different mediums to share stories." There have been adaptations that have been called better than the original. (Another mentioned that The Thing is a remake of an adaptation.) Maybe not applying to JttW let alone done by BMW, but something to keep in mind for adaptations.
"It makes a lot of sense to be protective of the original. To be afraid of what might happen if the adaptation of this thing you have opened your heart to goes poorly. But that’s a fear of the risk involved, not so much a fear of adaptation itself."
--
I usually really like your posts about JttW and all that is related to it, but I have noticed you struggle a lot with properly criticizing and in general analyzing anything adapting it.
I feel a little surprised considering how open/encouraging even at times you've been for fanfiction--a form of adaptation let's be honest here.
I think something you should look at is Dominic Noble's channel and his video...
Maybe even the Overly Sarcastic Productions videos that summarize the JttW, I'm curious about your thoughts--taking into understanding your beliefs as you presented them here.
I'm a Theravada Buddhist. I saw many people interpreting the story and meaning behind Black Myth Wukong, differently. But I hope the devs team didn't intend to insult Buddha Dhamma by recreating this new story and distort the meaning of Buddhahood or Enlightenment itself..
I don't know if they intended to insult Buddhism, but I can say that their presentation of Buddhism in the game is disrespectful.
@ryin-silverfish recently posted a wonderful essay on what's known as the "JTTW Conspiracy Theory," which is a method of interpreting the story by twisting details, making the heavenly hierarchy look evil. The game follows this method. I recommend that you read the essay:
I unknowingly ran into the JTTW Conspiracy Theory a couple of years ago. A Chinese article claimed that the Buddha lies in the novel. This is my rebuttal.
I greatly think, as I've seen it come up time and again whenever this game is brought up, is people becoming interested in JttW. I'm positive you got more traffic since this game was released, cause people want to know what it's based on.
Something called a "Conspiracy Theory" does not invite any sense of truth… But I also do not see what it has to do with BMW. Or what you mean by "The game follows this method." I don't know; maybe it flew over my head, but it doesn't seem like your most informed takes, which surprises me with all the research you do, and I usually like your articles.
I won't mention Does the Buddha Lie in Journey to the West? Too much because it doesn't involve in the overall argument I will present about adaptations in general (maybe I should reblog the response post, but this all started because of this post, so), but for the sake of responding to this post… I don't have any issue with your response to Ye Zhiqiu. I find it the most reasonable thing presented to me out of everything connected to this post and another good article by you, though a part of me wants to read his article directly; however, I am unable to read the language, and online translation can involve some level of incorrectness.
Anyways, more is below. It, uh, got long. I'm sorry if this possibly comes off as rude, I say this as I do have some struggles with identifying emotion and text especially makes it harder.
I just read the post from Ryin-Silverfish, so I will put my immediate thoughts on it. It talked a lot about JCT but little about the game. In addition, how they explained JCT makes me see it even less... Tho, I find it weird that they call out A Chinese Odyssey, considering that's a drama-comedy and most things are done for humor effect rather than a commentary (not that there isn't any; I feel that it is impossible for someone's view/beliefs to not color a work to a degree)--I do not want to say 'reading too much into it' because I don't think that can be true of anything. Still, I feel it's a bit 'watching with an altered view of it.' I have seen the first two parts, and unfortunately, part 3.
A point I've seen in that post and here <https://www.tumblr.com/journeytothewestresearch/762214744615763968/ive-read-your-articles-on-your-blog-i-cant?source=share> is that BMW makes all gods evil, which I would disagree with. Erlang, for all that he was involved in, is not evil as he helps Wukong (even yearning for him at times, ngl that was a... charged battle). I would even argue the Demon Bull family wasn't evil or the Spider family. So on that point, the JCT-BMW theory is just a theory.
Edit: some time after making this post I've seen the true ending, and also an interesting video by Jaobird (Black Myth: Wukong is Actually Insane - Before You Buy Black Myth: Wukong) that talks about his experience and feelings. Something he mentions is the lore entries, how in-depth they are, and the large amount of them, and I think that points to the idea that the developers cared more than some people think. The animations at the end of each chapter I think points to this too. I cannot comment, however, on anything about "distort the meaning of Buddhahood or Enlightenment", though I can see an interpretation both ways of yes or no, because of me being rather new to learning these things and not living in an area with any form of Buddhism so no exposure growing up past knowing that Buddhism is a thing.
And regarding your earlier response about adaptations in that post, this will be rude, but get over yourself. This is honestly spiraling too much, but I think it clouds your view and overwrites your better judgment of any work based on JttW, which you admit to somewhat. You cannot properly analyze BMW with this view that "In general, I don't like adaptations," as it will automatically put BMW in a negative light for you and make you more negative than critical before even looking at the game itself.
Adaptations can be good; whether or not BMW does it is another argument, but disregarding something because it's an adaptation (not even about how it adapts the thing) is just a closed view of it.
Mind you, I've only seen up to the 5th chapter (edit: now true ending) and haven't read the lore entries and such, so I'm not speaking as a BMW fan or anything--for what I've seen so far, it's alright--or as someone particularly knowledgable about it. I'm speaking more from my experiences with mythologies or historical figures adapted to various works. Such as the Greek gods or Arthurian media, even something like Peter Pan. And my research into what makes an adaptation... and my deep dive into as many adaptations of the JttW as possible; what can I say? I have fun with them. (Except for Conquering the Demons, that was a bad movie).
Adaptations are more than just taking the book and making it another medium, keeping 100% as is, despite the common definition or what many people think. To take from Oxford, an adaptation is "the process of making a work of art upon the basis of elements provided by an earlier work in a different, usually literary, medium." And "distinctions are commonly drawn between ‘faithful’ adaptations, in which the distinctive elements (characters, settings, plot events, dialogue) of the original work are preserved as far as the new medium allows, and ‘free’ adaptations, sometimes called ‘versions’ or ‘interpretations,’ in which significant elements of the original work are omitted or replaced by wholly new material."
There will be changes because how people view and/or understand a particular concept changes over time; the whole joke about "historians will call them friends" comes from historians hesitant to put any label on people because how homosexuality was understood has changed over time (from the view of the people then and the historian of any particular era afterward).
Maybe someone wants to "adapt" it to their modern era (whenever that is) and/or change the allegory. Maybe it's JttW, but its setting is changed to 1920s Germany, or the allegory for heaven is changed from 16th-century China and the criticism of it, changed to 20th-century America and the criticism of it. [You definitely see this with Arthurian literature and other mediums, which are constantly adapting on itself, most often Le Morte D'Arthur, or changing the allegory such as Arthur the good chivalrous king vs Arthur the lazy bum look at our original oc Lancelot (I like Lancelot but). Does this make, say, BBC Merlin a bad show cause it changed Merlin into a servant boy who secretly had magic? No, it's a lousy show cause it kept fumbling on how to tell its story and holding back on revealing that Merlin had magic to Arthur until Arthur died was highly dumb.] Nezha Reborn is a damn good movie, even though it involves Nezha dying and Wukong being the cooky old fool and is set in a different time period entirely--it is still an adaptation, and it isn't 100% faithful to JttW or Investiture of the Gods in the case of Nezha.
Sometimes, though, the original work would not work 100% faithfully in another medium--musicals come to mind. I doubt a musical could be entirely faithful to the novel because the time it would take for a musical would be outlandish and unrealistic to do, things would have to be cut out or altered.
To go even further, dipping into slightly extreme, but what about fanart? Art on its own is adapting the work. Is it not worth looking at if someone puts Sun Wukong in modern clothing? Or interpret Tripitaka as something other than a monk?
Is creative expression not allowed? Because it's an adaptation?
I wanted to add something someone on Discord said to me about adaptations. "Adaptations have been a thing basically as long as we’ve had two different mediums to share stories." There have been adaptations that have been called better than the original. (Another mentioned that The Thing is a remake of an adaptation.) Maybe not applying to JttW let alone done by BMW, but something to keep in mind for adaptations.
"It makes a lot of sense to be protective of the original. To be afraid of what might happen if the adaptation of this thing you have opened your heart to goes poorly. But that’s a fear of the risk involved, not so much a fear of adaptation itself."
--
I usually really like your posts about JttW and all that is related to it, but I have noticed you struggle a lot with properly criticizing and in general analyzing anything adapting it.
I feel a little surprised considering how open/encouraging even at times you've been for fanfiction--a form of adaptation let's be honest here.
I think something you should look at is Dominic Noble's channel and his video...
Maybe even the Overly Sarcastic Productions videos that summarize the JttW, I'm curious about your thoughts--taking into understanding your beliefs as you presented them here.
I'm a Theravada Buddhist. I saw many people interpreting the story and meaning behind Black Myth Wukong, differently. But I hope the devs team didn't intend to insult Buddha Dhamma by recreating this new story and distort the meaning of Buddhahood or Enlightenment itself..
I don't know if they intended to insult Buddhism, but I can say that their presentation of Buddhism in the game is disrespectful.
@ryin-silverfish recently posted a wonderful essay on what's known as the "JTTW Conspiracy Theory," which is a method of interpreting the story by twisting details, making the heavenly hierarchy look evil. The game follows this method. I recommend that you read the essay:
I unknowingly ran into the JTTW Conspiracy Theory a couple of years ago. A Chinese article claimed that the Buddha lies in the novel. This is my rebuttal.