Dw Meta - Tumblr Posts
thinking again about the idea that gallifreyan would have temporal pronouns that references an individual time lord ‘in general’ as opposed to referencing a specific rengeneration. and how the gallifreyan language probably has complex verb tenses or conjugations around not when events take place in the timestream but also tenses relating to where two time lords are in relation to each other.
in this vein, i love the idea that gallifreyan has three conjugations or words for the concept of “i can’t do or tell you that”:
“i am physically unable to do that / I don’t have the info you need”
“i am choosing to withhold this information and/or not do this / i promised i would not do or reveal this”
“i cannot tell you or do this because it would violate the laws of time / it gives you too much foreknowledge / it’s likely to cause a paradox”
while #1 and #2 can intersect, it makes sense to me that #3 would be its own separate concept or word. that it’s not just that you’re choosing to withhold something: you are bound by the laws of time to withhold it. you may badly, desperately, want to help this person change their future, but you know doing so could cause incredible damage to the timestream. “i’m so sorry. if it were up to me, i would tell you, but the universe won’t allow me to say.”
OKAY so I am re-listening to "Death and The Queen" again and I am having Thoughts™.
I can't find any info about when this drama takes place continuity-wise, but my personal placement would be after "Planet of The Ood" (4x3) and before "The Sontaran Stratagem" (4x4) because 4x4-4x6 take place directly following each other with Donna stating at the end of 4x6 that she plans to travel with the Doctor forever. Donna's determination to continue traveling w him is in keeping with the conclusion of Death and The Queen, where she comes to the decision that the Doctor IS her "happily ever after," as it were. Placing the drama after "Fires of Pompeii" and "Planet of The Ood" also makes sense with Donna's desire in the audio drama to have a break from "the extraordinary" of traveling with the Doctor (specifically, horrific death and destruction,) which adds understandable context to her seemingly being so willing to leave the Doctor after searching for him for so long.
(Don't talk to me about the ending of Forest of The Dead. It's unlikely Donna would have left the Doctor even if she found Lee. Donna's desire to confirm whether Lee was real could be easily contextualized by her wanting to know how much of her experiences inside CAL were a fabrication, and what the supposed "perfect husband" persona would have said about her if it was drawn from her own mind. Also it was written by Moffatt so it shouldn't count anyway.)
ANyway, what I actually wanted to talk about. Notably, considerable emphasis is placed on Donna enjoying her role as Queen and especially caring for her subjects and having power to help people. A greater amount of text is dedicated to her talking about how as Queen she can care for her subjects than her love for Rudolph, even before the reveal that he is human(?) trash. Her attachment to the role of Queen that marrying Rudolph will grant her is established to be largely based upon her passion for helping people rather than luxuries associated with rank, especially in view of the montage of how royal life on Gorotainia is not as glamorous as she hoped but is still enthralled by being Queen. Later in the story, when danger has appeared, her main role in the story is sacrificing and taking the lead to protect her subjects.
Notably, when things start going downhill and Rudolph starts talking to her about the difficult choices that he must make as royalty she comments that Rudolph is “just like HIM” (the Doctor) and that she went with Rudolph to escape these darker aspects of her travels with the Doctor, specifically the hard choices that go with the role the Doctor plays in the universe (while she doesn’t connect these concepts directly, these two statements are placed very close to one another textually.)
Only when her relationship with Rudolph and role as Queen seems like it will involve some of the same dark choices that her travels with Doctor did does Donna decide she doesn’t want to be involved anymore, which is quickly reversed when she finds out she needs to become Queen in order to protect her people. (I love Donna. In case you can’t tell.)
The narrative has established that a large part of Donna’s attachment to her relationship with Rudolph is potential authority to help and guide people, and that her main interest in pursuing a life with Rudolph rather than her travels with the Doctor was her perception that her role as Queen of Gorotainia would not involve the same death and destruction she has seen with the Doctor. Perfectly understandable after experiencing something like Pompeii.
Donna’s compassion and empathy have been essential components of her character since her introduction, with her wanting to protect the Doctor despite being irritated with him and feeling sorrow for the children of a Rancoss that wanted her to be eaten in “The Runaway Bride”, her taking the time to mention Stacy in “Partners In Crime,” and literally everything in “Fires of Pompeii” and “Planet of The Ood’. Donna has always taken the time and the energy to think of others and work to protect them, even this early in her run. In view of how deeply she feels the pain of others, it is understandable that she would find the idea of a world where she could help others from a position of power without all of the death and chaos and destruction appealing, and her outrage at Rudolph for once again putting her in a position where she has to witness (and potentially be responsible for) terrible things happening to innocent people is believable. He proves that being a Gorotainian royal is like being the Last of The Time Lords. On a smaller scale, sure, but still.
So the text (and Donna) have set up the idea of Rudolph being similar to the Doctor in role, so what is the difference? Rudolph doesn’t much care about people. He is willing to sacrifice his own people quite coldly.
The Doctor does care about people. How good of a person he is, or how good of a job he does caring for people is up for debate, but he cares.
Which all leads me to this quote from “Beautiful Chaos,” that I cannot believe is cannon and real and published.
Why does Donna love the Doctor?
"I wish you could see what I see. We've been to places, to worlds, to futures and pasts you could only dream about. I think half of them I dreamed up because they can't be real. But they are. And everywhere we go, we make a difference. We put things right, we make people happier. That's what the Doctor is all about. He finds a way for the universe to make sense. And I love him for it.”
Donna Noble wants to make a difference. No matter where she goes, she cannot escape the death and pain and suffering and chaos and nonsense that is the universe, and she can’t help but want to help. And right there beside her, the Doctor is working to put things right too. And she loves him for it.
We have this entire drama dedicated to Donna wanting to make a difference, while also escaping the darkness of the universe, and she learns she can’t. There are no happily ever afters.
Except with the Doctor.
I have so many feelings guys.
This is what I was talking about, he looks so unhinged in this whole episode you can tell donna's not scared of him anymore because you know if he was being this *whatever he is* when they first met it would have freaked her out but now she's just like: "He's just a sad strange little man and also my spaceman." No coincidence that this comes after Pompeii either.
In The Runaway Bride she does trust him, but she still admits she's scared of him at the end of the episode. Then in Partners In Crime she gets (understandably) freaked out by the whole "mating" misunderstanding... I obviously don't believe she was terrified of him or anything, but you can really see that they've gotten to a deeper level of trust after Pompeii. That's kind of what on-screen development of a relationship is supposed to be, and its part of why I find them so compelling.
NO ONE IS DONNA Big oof with everything u said about Martha. I was so proud of her when she “got out”, like cheering at the screen, then I found out lots of people thought she was annoying and I was like ??? She’s literally just a queen??? Pure class and smart as a whip. Love her forever. I like to think of myself as a certified t*nr*ose hater lollllll
The relationship between her and nine was just so… pure? I could actually believe she wasn’t cheating on Micky while as an audience understand the chemistry? And then I hated The Christmas Invasion where her entire character is reduced to “oh nu, nu Doctor can do nothing.” I was personally offended by that writing choice. I TOTALLY agree w what you said about her getting over the whole thing so quickly. With how absolutely distraught she was over him regenerating (which is understandable in a sense but must have been pretty hurtful for him) she seemed to get over his personality change too quickly. It really made me resent her for not taking time to really mourn nine, if you know what I mean. I made a whole post about this a while back, but the writing reads to me as Rose treats ten differently than nine because she thinks he’s attractive… which is just bleh. Not to mention basically the first thing they do in s2 is establish she hasn’t broken up w Mickey but is obviously trying to start something w the Doctor. Why??? She’s like a totally different character.
from a structural narrative perspective, the way they handled the regeneration was awful if they wanted me to buy she was his soulmate or whatever RTD says. In view of what actually happens in the show (ahem, Journey’s End, School Reunion, ahem) I was convinced I was supposed to believe that she loved him, but she couldn’t fully commit, or more importantly empathize with, the more alien aspects of him. Which is fine, totally understandable. But that’s why I just can’t get behind them as a couple. I genuinely thought they were setting up that Rose loved him, but she wanted things from him he couldn’t give, partially because she couldn’t give him what he needed as an ageless being who lives a life that humans can’t really comprehend. Someone to empathize with the unknowable, and stop him when he goes too far. and they both move on with their lives, even if they didn’t want to be separated the way they were. I thought it was very mature and a good end. I was pretty miffed that they made her reappearance in JE all about wanting to get back to him, because I wanted her to be her own person! Like she was in s1! You’re telling me it’s been ten years or some and she’s still only about him, not her dad who so much of her character was devoted to??? Not her mum??? Don’t get me started on JE how she just starts kissing his clone w out a toss for hurting him.😤
which was, I might add, perfect setup for Donna being the person who could give him that understanding of his burden, challenge his assumptions, accept his differences, endlessly curious but never pushing for more than he could give…never asking him to be something he’s not… I felt like with her he could have been able to truly have a relationship with an equal. That brought out his better qualities because he finally had that need to be challenged and understood filled. If they had more time, I really think they would have been inevitable. RTD tried so hard to keep them platonic in one packed season and he kind of failed lol, imagine if we had more seasons. Ugh I just love them… especially that they could have been canon without having to go back through the series and scribble out previous relationships. Their connection is strengthened to me as a viewer by the contrast to previous loves. They feel like a warm hug, like coming home. I’m gushing oh no, oh dear.
I just don’t get why The Ship(TM) for so many is t*nr*ose and im a crusty old fanhag about it.
Hey random sorry but I love your account
THANK U SO MUCH!!!! I was looking at the tags u left on my Death and The Queen essay the other day and I was like !💖!
mad respect for the nine/rose content btw, they really were phenomenal. I try to be the change I want to see (read: shamelessly stanning tendonna) but I adored the relationship between rose and nine.
ONe last RB to have your lovely concluding thoughts on my page :) You're thoughts are so insightful and your delivery is really respectful.
Ten is so terrible. That's why I love him so much. Totally agree about it not being anyone's obligation to fix ten, or anyone. Actually that's kind of why I wrote that long post about Donna's side of the relationship, because often I find that the female character's perspective in relationships is disregarded, so whenever I'm trying to flex my English lit obsession with regards to shipping I make an effort to examine what the female character gets from the relationship (in a 'is this healthy' way as well as how her narrative could be enhanced by the pairing.)
Part of what makes them so compatible imo is that a lot of the time that she’s being/doing what he needs is because it’s what she needs. She searches him out because she wants the excitement and adventure of life on the TARDIS, not because she’s looking for him because he needs her. She expresses concern that he’s still on his own, but I felt like the way she brought it up implied that it wasn’t the reason she was looking for him. She had her own motives, because the adventure was what she decided SHE wanted (ugh the queen). In Pompeii, she doesnt ask him to save someone because it’s what he needs. It’s because she needs it, and it turns out he needed it too. (Take courtesy of my mom lol love u mom) I see people talking about how she is the Doctor’s equal, but it’s not brought out enough that he is her equal as well. Donna is so smart, talkative, creative, and driven, and he absolutely embraces that. She’s loud, rude, and brash and he appreciates it. I always got the impression that people around her treat her like she’s too much, but with him that’s just being on the same wavelength lol. They are wonderful friends, with so many common goals, and a lot of healthy compromise. They're also totally not perfect and that's another thing I love about them. They feel real to me, because of their bumps and bruises and stupidities and toxicities. Love them to bits.
I will admit it's fun to hate a character or ship sometimes, but not to make people feel bad. I try to tag my critical or anti stuff appropriately so that I can enjoy a good whinge, while making it hopefully easy for people who like that character/ship to avoid.
ALSO SORRY FOR THIS MONSTER POST
Hey random sorry but I love your account
THANK U SO MUCH!!!! I was looking at the tags u left on my Death and The Queen essay the other day and I was like !💖!
mad respect for the nine/rose content btw, they really were phenomenal. I try to be the change I want to see (read: shamelessly stanning tendonna) but I adored the relationship between rose and nine.