Orv Analysis - Tumblr Posts

the trauma that the 73rd demon realm would’ve given KimCom is spoken about a lot, but I haven’t seen anyone get into the specifics of it. let’s put the focus on yoo joonghyuk and the kids.

as said in the notes of the last reblog, i feel like the real (as he believed) death of kim dokja happening in his arms would’ve deeply affected yjh’s psyche. imagine you find someone who so perfectly contrasts you and then having to kill him. he would’ve thought he lost the man forever. and the fact that the man was in his arms as he turned to dust? it would’ve ruined him because why does everything he touch become ashes and dust? and this is third round yoo jonghyuk. he just got betrayed to hell by anna croft. it’s lucky he didn’t remember, otherwise he would’ve never spoken to dokja again. the contrast between a cradle and a stab to the chest is so intriguing and so depressing. like the symbolism??? the opening to a character psyche????? this is why I like that one fanart (I can’t find it anymore someone help)

Ok I went I on a bit of a tangent so I’ll keep the children short. Of course, killing their father figure was deeply traumatizing. No child should ever have to go through that. And the fact that he encouraged it? I could go so deep into the psychological effects that death still has on the kids afterward. But the thing that’s so jarring to me is the fact that he tells them to “treat this as a game.” Correct me if I’m wrong, but that was the first time he ever “played a game” with them. That action is a moment of bonding between a father and a child. Dokja tried to shed some light into the horrible scenario they found themselves in, but his attempt ended up making everything so much darker. To take such an innocent phrase and distort it until it’s unrecognizable in the garden of death, blood, and mourning…

i just realized all three of them broke into two…someone analyze this for me PLEASE! the dots exist but I can’t connect them

Lying on the floor in a puddle of my tears and staring blankly at the ceiling as I once again think about all the fucked up, multi-dimensional ways that Kim Dokja, Yoo Joonghyuk and Han Sooyoung encompass the god vs creation and deity vs worshipper dynamics

another day of living, another day of overanalyzing the creation, his creator, and their worshipper (yoohankim) dynamics:

yjh tells hsy “I knew you wouldn't die from the beginning” in chapter 371 despite this being the arc where they learn to allow him his own autonomy. he ‘kills’ them both despite knowing neither would die, similar to how a deity’s creation can’t kill his own creator & how a god can’t kill his last follower.

the kills symbolized gaining his identity and autonomy, but it was a symbolic gesture and nothing more.

the three of them are still molecularly connected to the degree in which one could not live without the others, but Yoo Joonghyuk is the only one who wouldn’t exist without the other two

my favorite part about yoohan is the fact that hsy is just as much of a slave to the story as yjh is

the demon world arc centers itself primarily around four relationships that kim dokja has: his relationship with biyoo, his relationship with han myungoh, his relationship with jang hayoung, and his relationship with yoo joonghyuk. what I find very interesting about this is that the throughlines of all the first three relationships, as either introduced or recontexualized in this arc, have to do with parenthood/the responsibility of creation.

the last arc, dark castle, heavily examined kim dokja's relationship with his own mother. now, in this arc, he is taking on the role of a parent and the associated guilt and responsibility with it. let's take a look at the first three relationships mentioned.

biyoo - biyoo hatches this arc! though kim dokja needs her abilities as a dokkaebi to survive here, he feels some measure of guilt about bringing her into this world where she has no choice but to love the story. she's not a human infant, so their relationship isn't the same as a traditional parent and child bond, but he still views himself as her parent and feels responsible for her. her utility as a helping hand in his survival and his guilt towards both her and her past life as 41st shin yoosung are both major components of their interactions this arc.

jang hayoung- while kim dokja is emphatically not her parent, it was his comments on twsa that created her character. again, like biyoo, he feels some guilt and discomfort with his role in bringing her into the world. while it is plot-important that he helps her develop past her emotional problems this arc, I can't help but read his interest in helping her develop as being related to his personal sense of responsibility to her. he takes on the role of an older mentor to her in this arc. (you also super get the sense that kim dokja does not understand Kids These Days lmao)

these two relationships inform each other quite a bit. biyoo highlights kim dokja's responsibility as a parent, on a very mundane level. meanwhile, jang hayoung highlights kim dokja's responsibility as a story creator. both of these roles have things in common, and since biyoo is a story creator and jang hayoung is a real person rather than a fictional character, there's aspects of both roles present in both relationships.

kim dokja struggles quite a bit with viewing himself as an active party in the world. dark castle, as part of its setup in informing kdj's ongoing character, dealt quite heavily with how his mother's choices and his reliance on the fourth wall created this problem. now, he is forced to acknowledge his direct involvement in the creation of two separate people, and the veil of fiction cannot protect him. he is a parent. and his comments on twsa created a living person. he cannot easily deny, now, that his involvement with twsa is something that had no consequences. he hasn't quite processed all of that yet, but the feelings of guilt and responsibility are difficult to ignore. both of these relationships are priming him to deal with more difficult stuff down the line. we'll get to that in a minute.

meanwhile, han myungoh serves as an interesting parallel to kim dokja now! after learning that han myungoh has a daughter and was changed by his responsibilities as a parent, kim dokja is forced to reevaluate his relationship with someone who was formerly only his cruel boss. his presence in the story brings forward a lot of observations on parenthood that kim dokja would not have otherwise noticed. and... it also provides setup for kim dokja further coming to understand that people can grow past his impressions of them.

which brings us to yoo joonghyuk. THE focal point through the novel regarding kim dokja's involvement in the world of the scenarios. while his role in this arc is primarily dealing with his and kim dokja's relationship on a mundane level - and them literally impersonating each other - his presence is a reminder, something highlights those meditations on creation, responsibility, and involvement in one's story. if jang hayoung was created as a foil for yoo joonghyuk, and kim dokja is helping yoo joonghyuk develop in this timeline, can kim dokja really say that his reading of twsa did not have any consequences...? the thematic and emotional groundwork laid by this arc lays down a strong foundation for that question to be brought forward and explored more in future arcs.

Kim Dokja is called “Demon King of Salvation” but he does not allow himself salvation. In doing so, he dooms Kim Namwoon to an unsalvageable fate in the first act, which directly foreshadows his own denial for salvation. In this essay I will—

I think the biggest tragedy in yoohankim is the fact that none of them are 100% themselves and none of them will ever recover that 50% or 51% or ?% of themselves ever and they just have to live with that.

“If one entity is divided into two exact and separate entities, which one of them can be called real?”

y’all ever think about how Sangah never really escaped from being romanticized by people? i

I mean, dokja was never completely able to erase the romanticized version of her that he had before the scenarios. Dare I say it only got worse. I think that’s part of why people criticize her for being too much of a “Mary Sue”

It’s interesting how her development in dokja’s went from real to not-so-real through the novel while the novel characters had the opposite development, but that’s another topic.

Anyways, everyone in kimcom views Sangah as this perfect girl despite her dislike for such a perception of her… everyone except Han Sooyoung.

Happy pride month everybody

Han Sooyoung potentially the most doomed by the narrative character of all time. She wrote the entire narrative that doomed her. She was a lonely and neglected but otherwise normal child and then at some point in her young teen years she gets possesed by a god that uses her body every night to write the story that will destroy the world. Her mind and body are no longer fully her own, they've been hijacked by someone who is leaving her exhausted and with confusing dreams, someone who is sealing her fate and pushing her along towards her destiny without HSY having a single clue. She will follow the pre determined path this God laid out for her, will go through all the suffering and pain that this God has planned, until it is too late for her to turn back. When she finally realises the truth she will be in too deep, and her only choice will be to continue along this chosen path. She loves too fiercely to choose any other way. She will doom the world over and over again, selfishly sacrificing millions and selflessly sacrificing every part of herself because her monstrous heart is too full of love. This one boy she cares for must stay alive. There is no price she will not pay in order to make that happen.

After all this you'd think she'd be furious at this God but how can she? The god is her, just a version of her further along the narrative who cannot change her nature anymore than young Han Sooyoung or old Han Sooyoung can. The god will write and write to keep this boy alive without ever getting to see him or talk to him, and in the end she will flicker out to be nothing but a part of HSY's memories. Every version of Han Sooyoung is tied to this narrative, there is no one point where you can stop and blame a version of her. They are all guilty and they will all do it over and over again. They are too full of fierce, selfish love for any other alternative.

Kim Dokja having never felt parental love after his mother’s arrest and having been neglected (and maybe abused) by his foster home.

Lee Gilyoung having never felt parental love after his parents’ death and having been neglected (and maybe abused) by his aunt.

Kim Dokja taking Lee Gilyoung in after the first scenario and giving Lee Gilyoung a parental figure to look up to.

Lee Gilyoung feeling parental love for the first time since his parents and attaching himself to that figure.

Kim Dokja abandoning him time and time again, either through actually leaving or getting himself killed. Kim Dokja clearly favoring Shin Yoosung and Biyoo over Lee Gilyoung. Kim Dokja being simultaneously the most present and most absent parental figure on his life.

Lee Gilyoung finally getting used to Kim Dokja’s constant disappearing and reappearing act… only for his Hyung to never reappear again.

Y’all ever think about how Lee Gilyoung’s parents died in a fire and then Kim Dokja’s first death was by dying in a fire?

the concept of Han Sooyoung being God, Kim Dokja being the messiah, and Yoo Joonghyuk being the preacher

hate it when stupid people read orv and get mad

“Kimcom only survived because they knew Dokja >:(“

Yes, Jared.

“It’s plot armor!”

You’re right, Jared

yoohankim but with the Madonna-Whore Complex

ORV reels you in with the "What if all my useless interests were suddenly SUPER important in real life and I was better than everyone for investing all that time in them" isekai power fantasy and then when you're invested pulls a bait and switch like "Actually they WERE always useful and necessary! They are what kept you going through life all this time! Even if that was the only way they ever served you, it still was not a waste of time because the only thing that matters is that they helped you survive"

i've talked before about how kim dokja struggles to form a relationship with yoo sangah because he sees her as a 'protaganist' figure, slotting her into a role as 'the heroine' which does not fit her but does handily prevent him from having to (gasp) form a connection! and i think han sooyoung initially does the same thing and thats part of why yoo sangah gets so much on her nerves. han sooyoung is the only other character who seems to see the world as tropes and cliches just as much as kim dokja does, and she assigns herself the role of villain and yoo sangah the role of hero and does the subsequent antagonizing expected of such a dynamic. but i really don't think its something yoo sangah is interested in entertaining - she doesn't like han sooyoung initially due to all the violent murder she does, but it's not at all based in this good vs evil struggle that han sooyoung is trying to create. kim dokja didn't really get to see all of yoo sangah until he let her out of that heroine role - similarly, i wish we got to see the moment yoo sangah escaped that role in han sooyoung's eyes.

Whoever yoo mia killed to survive the first scenario...what if she cannibalized them afterwards?

First, it adds a sinister chill to her telling jung heewon 'but I'm so hungry, i haven't eaten since morning!' when she takes her to kim dokja. jung heewon then deliberately didn't react to this & didn't tell kim dokja in detail about what state she found yoo mia in. Perhaps she would lie by omission to him because she wanted to protect yma from judgement/protect kdj from the weight of that knowledge. of course he would know anyway if it was mentioned in TWSA and that's interesting too because yoo joonghyuk had to see that same scene a thousand times while rescuing her, what his innocent kid sister had to do to survive the apocalypse.

Being a cannibal also slots nicely in with yoo mia's main characterisation: being always being hungry/ having a bottomless stomach (that's even her skill)... it's a headcanon that adds interesting elements for me anyway

I thought of Kim Dokja and everyone who has ever loved him

i just saw a video that said “maybe we’re better at wanting each other than having each other” im going to throw up now

orv is genuinely one of the most well done and nuanced examinations of trauma, depression, fiction as an escape, media as a tool, stories as a connection, communication, capitalism and its resulting commodification and consumerism, and (very importantly) healing and the necessity of interconnection, that i have ever seen.

and it's all packaged up as this. cliche web novel. like, oh look at me i'm just another series stuffed with currently popular tropes, surely i won't change you forever with a deeply impactful and highly emotional experience :)

the genius. the audacity. the meta of it all.