It's Kinda Interesting How Damian, Yuri And Nightfall Are All Presented By The Narrative. Like, If You're

It's kinda interesting how Damian, Yuri and Nightfall are all presented by the narrative. Like, if you're willing to look for them, they're given redeeming qualities, but the story isn't willing to sacrifice the main characters' standing just for the resolution of the former.

We see Damian bullying Anya, but then you see his issues with his family and how he craves attention from them. You're like damn I hope things get better for him but not at the expense of Anya's feelings.

We see Yuri, his obsession with his sister and how he's a threat to Twilight's mission, but you can kinda understand how a young person like him was brainwashed by nationalistic propaganda. You're like damn I hope things get better for him but not at the expense of Twilight's mission (which includes the Forgers slowly becoming a real family).

We see Nightfall and her blind obsession with Twilight, but then you see how she's been hiding her feelings because she knows she can't really have a happy life with him unless the cold war ends; she just has very poor control over those feelings. You're like damn I hope things get better for her but not at the expense of Yor's feelings and her place within the Forger family.

(No manga spoilers please)

I can only hope the new Paris special won't force Marinette/ Toxinelle into the role of the "chaotic baddest bitch" for superficial praise and keeping Adrien/ Griffe Noire as nothing but her unconditional support again and the "good" one. Because literally from the way the powers of Ladybug and Chat Noir work that's bullshit and the MUCH weaker story premise character wise.

Toxinelle has no offensive powers. She can be as smart as she wants in this scenario her powers are needed for AFTER the Butterfly akumatized someone to save the city, so she can prevent said saving from happening.

Griffe Noire would be required to first nuke the city so the butterfly can react to something and that means alternative Adrien/ Griffe Noire would - the longer all that went on - have needed to let go of all morality he once had and agree to become the moster of the two so SHE can remain level headed and get the Butterfly from the hero.

That's still alot of pressure and burden on Toxinelle's shoulders, being the one who has to be the light at the end of the tunnel for both of them to get their happy ending in a better world. But for the love of God, Adrien throwing out his humanity and only holding onto her and his dead mother

If this is to be believed:

Is ALOT worse and fitting as the conflict's heart piece.

I can only hope the special will be reasonable enough that Toxinelle will be the lesser evil of ShadyClaw and not waste so much story potential for another round of "Chloé the awful bitch". There is so much more interesting stuff you can do with Marinette than that, especially in the Toxinelle field.

Already as Ladybug Marinette showcases extremely dangerous anti-hero tendencies where she becomes so strategic that everyone involved stops being human beings or mattering in the moment because she needs to get something important done.

Most crucial examples are how Emilie Agreste's dead body was used as a mere inhuman tool by her in "Recreation" to defeat her insane husband, by cataclysming the lift and letting it crash down on Emilie to force Gabriel to stand still. Only though that Marinette then barely gave Gabriel enough time to throw the lift sideways and he only managed to save himself and Emilie from being crushed in the nick of time.

Or you know, all of Marinette's horrifying plan in "Destruction" that put several life in danger by sending Monarque to helpless civilians (even to ANNOY HIM) and Chat Noir was literally turned into a non-human object served on a silver plate to Monarque. He couldn't move an inch like a human is to be expected or even BREATH while Monarque went to grab for his throat while Marinette herself stood save and sound in the back because all she actually thought about in that plan were the Kwamis and herself (not even bringing up how fucked up it was to not even let Chat Noir know that her plan involves him having to possibly live with having cataclysmed a person.)

Everyone else MONARQUE had to keep save in her plan by not being the awful and sadistic monster they thought him to be. Tolerating all kinds of disrespectful bullshit and not using any Second chance or other miraculous powers besides voyage, or for the lols quartering Chat Noir's statue for example in a second's notice.

Marinette's plan in "Destruction" was horrifying and impossibly irresponsible in how she instinctively dehumanized everyone but herself and the Kwamis in it without noticing it and 100% relied on MONARQUE to be a decent and reasonable enough person underneath so she could get away with the insane endangerment and dehumanization of everyone but herself (especially Chat Noir).

Her final battle with Monarque had Marinette come back to this questionable morality when she pulled a low-blow anti hero move by dragging the dead spouse of the villain further into the fight, and risking to take any human dignity away from Emilie's remainings - who never wanted any of this being done in her name - by making it GABRIEL'S job to save and preserve her from Bug Noire.

Marinette 100% has some serious anti-hero tendencies in how she dehumanizes people sometimes as side-effect of her strategic mind and when she's either to caught up in her head or she thinks her goal justifies the means.

Jfc, quit the bullshit and let Toxinelle be the escalation of that side of Marinette because she and Adrien know their identities this time around - truly THEM against the world - and she's stuck in a position where Adrien was forced to let go of his humanity and other emotional attachments for their cause, is way too far gone by now and she has to make sure they actually win so all of this wasn't for nothing.

Give me a Marinette/ Toxinelle who made it out of her having been bullied alot worse and that's how she got into this, but by now she deep down fully regrets ever having started this and wished with every inch of her heart she could stop

but she knows she herself already hardly could live with herself after all this so she would never ask Adrien/ Griffe Noire to let go of the only hope he has at this point and live with the fact that he became an actual monster to preserve HER humanity, so she can save them both with the wish.

A Toxinelle who believes they already went too far to possibly go back and because of that she detaches herself from morality in the way it happened in "Recreation" with Emilie because in her (and Adrien's) mind they only have to win and everything will be okay again.

Adrien won't be a monster anymore and will return all together to the boy she once loved - and only still behaves like around Marinette or while thinking of his mother - and Paris, it's citizens, the entire world and THEMSELVES wont remember anymore what happened or that Toxinelle and Griffe Noire ever did any of this to them.

Give me TAHT Marinette/ Toxinelle please. For the love of GOD.

About Yor: she isn’t dense, but most likely indoctrinated by Garden

So I wanted to address this for a long while now, because I’ve seen one too many posts talking about Yor like she’s just an aloof assassin who doesn’t care about things outside her direct environment, which is why sometimes she says dense things. 

I’m well aware that she’s a fan favorite so people don’t mean her harm, yet I think the whole story actually hints at way more than her being dense, especially considering her background and who she still works for. 

In other words, since Yor was trained but also half raised by Garden’s leader, the Shopkeeper, it’s likely that, considering how they operate and what they’re about, they instilled in her a conditioned dependency since childhood or teenage years that would make her unable to learn things on her own without asking for their opinion, making it very hard for her to turn against them ever. 

Want a striking example? Her encounter with Melinda Desmond. 

Not only did she not know who Melinda was (but I mean, that at least could be understandable)…

…but she also didn’t know what a First Lady is. 

Sure, it’s funny on first glance, but after thinking about it, what does it betray? That Garden probably made sure over years Yor would never get the slightest basic info and understanding on what politics of this country are all about. Because if their strong soldiers start to get opinions of their own, then they could start disagreeing with Garden and turning on them. So, “let’s prohibit people having free thinking, so that they can remain good little pawns” as we “fight for peace in our country”.

In fact, for Yor, until a short time ago (when she met Loid and Anya), all she did was thought and decided for her by Garden and, to this day, she still voluntarily asks them for their agreement when she opens up her close circle little by little: she asked them if it was okay to marry Loid and then she asked them if it was okay to befriend Melinda. 

To be honest, that’s a scary ass thought process to envision, when Yor’s an independent working lady well into her 20s, but this shows how deep Garden’s indoctrination runs in Yor, since they got hold of her as a child/young teen. 

Another striking example is the way she always describes her job, in an almost childish way. Her nickname “thorn princess” aside, I always found it interesting that Yor’s aware she’s an assassin but she isn’t morally anguished at all about killing people and never mentions or distinguishes any grey area in her missions. In fact…

… it’s all in black and white and she clearly thinks that the people she kills are all evildoers (which as we saw in the recent arc with the Red Circus isn’t always the case and begs the rhetorical question “why does Garden get to decide who’s evil?”), therefore “she’s not doing anything wrong”, which also pretty much betrays how she was pushed into it. 

Long ago, Garden probably baited Yor with Yuri’s protection and told her that, since they’re “about peace”, Yor’s work would just help them to “fight against evil”. As a child, she wasn’t mentally fit to understand the deeper implications and then she was mentally conditioned to always do and think like Garden tells her to, which promotes this systematic childish description of her assassin’s job. 

Finally, please take notice of the Shopkeeper’s reaction the first time she tries to argue about her work, in the ship arc: 

Enough said, Garden’s awful. I’m sure there are more examples throughout the story, but I now want to talk about future character development. 

After all, since the story obviously calls for Yor to ditch Garden, to protect what’s actually important to her (Yuri, Loid and Anya), we actually do see her changing little by little so far, thanks to her living with Loid and Anya. Her coworkers quickly mentioned that she’s more lively ever since she got married and the ship arc overall emphasizes that her family is starting to become more important to her than her job, so there is high hope for Yor. :D

Additionally, while she’s still far away from noticing that Garden mentally drove her into a corner, she now openly voices her concerns that “she’s not normal” but that she wants to understand why in order to learn how to change. 

To be fair, fighting against indoctrination is tough and takes time so I’m very proud of her for slowly realizing that she ought to decide for herself from now on. :D 

TL;DR Yor is not dense. She was indoctrinated as a child by Garden and can only (for now) see the world through the filters they taught her. 

Ironically enough, the only character who knows about her real job and could, thus, notice that Yor isn’t being critical about Garden…… actually can’t because she’s a four year old who is too young to understand that Mama’s job is wrong. Well done, Endo-sensei!

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My experience being a fan of stuff

Omg I cant believe I never noticed that theres a war going on outside the window on the second season opening!

And when Twilight notices, he closes the curtain:

And Yor is seeing him do it, while Anya (who has never seen war) is just happily looking foward.

I am so deeply unwell right now like😭😭😭