911 Discourse - Tumblr Posts

the sunk-cost fallacy, the selling of a pipe-dream, and buddie

In a lot of discourse that’s happened of late, the question of “why are people continuing to cling to the belief that buddie is absolutely going canon despite writing on the wall indicating otherwise?”

The lovely @outrunningthedark wrote their thoughts here with others contributing to the conversation via tags. A common theme in those tags, of course, is the concept of sunk-cost fallacy.

Under a readmore as the rambling got a bit long.

The sunk-cost fallacy is a fallacy wherein somebody is unable to let go, to cut ties with so to speak, of an endeavor. Despite the overwhelming evidence suggesting they will not recoup the investment made into the concept/product/etc., the person is unable to let go of the endeavor because of that person’s belief that they’ve spent too much time and effort (possibly even money too) in it to let go.

In this case, the sunk-cost fallacy is applied to those who advocate for Buddie to go canon and have the belief that it’s the only storyline that makes sense. That the writers have simply written themselves into a corner and this is absolutely the only possible outcome. (Of a note, there’s like 7-10 writers in that room. Trust that one of them can get the team out of any “corner” they’ve supposedly been written into. That’s the benefit in having a writers room as opposed to one person writing the entire series. If you want an example of what happens when one person is writing the show, look at Euphoria.)

We can see this fallacy at work when people respond that there’s been six seasons of buildup! In that way, it’s reminding others that these people have (supposedly) been here for six seasons now and that their dedication, their advocacy, deserves to be rewarded. It also adds to this idea that the fans aren’t just fans and have been spending their time advocating for this ship to go canon.

You can see this especially in the post-705 discourse. A common point kept being reiterated was that anyone who decided they liked bucktommy were “merely settling” and that fans “shouldn’t enjoy bucktommy” because that’d tell the writers that we were fine with the current situation. These fans have seemingly missed the point where we as fans have absolutely zero control over what the writers room does. And crucially, we are not responsible for the writers deciding to embark on a bisexuality storyline for Evan Buckley. That was merely an extremely rare example of the powers that be (TPTB) embarking on a storyline in line with what fandom has accepted as fanon, but we as fans didn’t advocate for it, nor did we ever push the needle in the direction it needed.

On the flip side of this is of course the behavior of the big name fans (bnfs) that continue selling this pipe-dream, this sunk-cost fallacy. These are the fans that keep telling their thousands of followers how all of these signs absolutely must equate to this ship going canon. They’re posting such in-depth theories that the official 911 account appears to be taking the piss out of said fans in the recent post. Whether these bnfs believe what they post is true is regardless at this point because whatever they say the followers appear to hang on to every word spoken. They’re telling their followers through multiple posts how profitable the show will be when they confirm this ship as canon despite the fact that that fan certainly doesn’t work in the industry and clearly doesn’t have any insight into what the 10 million viewers of this show think, and they phrase it in a way to remind the followers that this is what they’re working for, that the arduous undertaking of being a fan of a fanon ship that in all likelihood may never go canon is worth it because they’ll not only get bragging rights but they’ll also get to supposedly see the show succeed in a way never seen before. (To which I cannot stress enough that this is a successful show. It’s the number one drama on network television. I don’t understand how you can argue that the show cannot succeed without this single fanon ship going canon when clearly it’s doing just fine without the ship going canon.)

This is the selling of a pipe-dream, and it is even more the case for those fans that monetize the content they make on other platforms (whether that’s by monetizing tweets or by joining the creators fund on TikTok).

But why do people believe these people? Especially if they’re new to the fandom post-704? That of course boils down to confirmation bias. The fans peddling the pipe-dream are saying exactly what the others want to hear, so of course they’ll hang on to every explanation, every theory, because it confirms what they want to happen. They too want the show to confirm the ship as canon to prove that they were right all along and that their dedication, their advocacy, has been worth it.

Once you factor in those facets, the situation occurring with Buddie canon 2k## becomes an even sadder case of “canon event cannot interfere” because the fans that believe in their heart of hearts that Buddie canon is the only truth will only ever be upset and miserable when reality doesn’t pan out in their favor. They’ll only ever spend their time lashing out at anybody who doesn’t agree with them because they have to keep holding on to the belief that their time and effort have been worth it because this time it’s going to be different.

And to be clear, it’s not wrong to ship a fanon ship. It’s not wrong to ship something that’ll never be canon. (I’ve shipped characters from completely different shows before; trust me when I say it’s okay to have fun with ships that will never become canon.) What is wrong is when people spend their time hurling insults and straight up bullying and harassing others who don’t believe the same thing as them. (And yes, there’s absolutely discussion to be had about the way big name fans also partake in bullying and harassment themselves because when you have the amount of followers those accounts have, there is a certain level of responsibility in the way you operate publicly on said platform.)

We are not a part of this show, we don’t control what’s about to happen on the show. The sooner people let go of expectation, start thinking critically, and start seeking out information for themselves instead of listening to whatever the big name accounts are peddling, the happier in the long run they’ll be.

Are people ok? Like you dont have a job? School? A life? Other shows to watch? Idk anything? 😭😭

istg this is the worst drama I'm seeing and i am an anime fan, like naruto (sasunaru ship) and freaking aot , i have seen some of the worst and nastiest wars, but what the HELL is happening here is outstanding just wow unbelievable

Keep yourself happy and safe everyone, its really really not worth all this hate and aggression 🤐🤐🤐

What in the cognitive-fucking-dissonance??? THEE woman who started the edgy “gay panic killing of a fictional gay man” joke movement is SHOCKED that she attracts and is attracted to homophobes?

You literally joked that if you were Tommy’s boyfriend (Buck), you’d shoot and kill the man for flirting with you. That is a hate crime. That is literally THEE definition of “gay panic.” You’re not the fantastical “wizard spells” blog; you’re the I use “it’s just a joke, bro”-as-a-shield blog.

Y’all literally have anons “keep tabs” on 911 fans who support ABC’s recent decision to add more queer representation into the show, sending y’all asks about what those fans are saying about the show and their favorite characters. And you’re SHOCKED to attract the same obsessive behavior? You’re SHOCKED that you attract toxicity? You’re SHOCKED that you attract other blogs that joke about homophobic violence?

Wizard spells, right? Oh, shit. Actually, it’s a joke about gay panic killing. But it’s still just a joke, right?

Wizard spells, right?

Actually— capital punishment. For the crime of *checks notes* going on a date with a man and cutting the date short. Didn’t know that death must be the legal consequence for not continuing a bad date.

Still just a joke, right?

Oh, look— I finally found the “Wizard spells,” among *checks notes* fantasizing about black and brown people murdering a white man, more guns, and… torture. Weird fantasies, man.

But still just a joke, right?

Wizard spells, right?

Well, I found “curses” and “voodoo” on this next list. Right alongside joking about death by firearm (again), death by execution/capital punishment (again), and—would you look at that—joking about death by AIDS. Joking about a gay character… dying of AIDS. Original.

How is THIS ^^^ is a step too far for y’all when it’s literally the EXACT same joke? This blog’s violent fantasies and this blog calling Tommy a predator is a step too far, but when you did the same, it wasn’t? Where do you think “edgy” jokes lead? Why do you think so many other blogs on here kept telling you that an “edgy joke” isn’t ever actually an “edgy joke”?

This is the culture you have created. You attract these personalities because you encourage their beliefs and behavior. But rather than own up to that and look critically at how your supposed “jokes” have created a toxic and hostile and truly obsessive and frightening culture, you’d rather ONCE AGAIN all call this a “ship war.”

There is no ship war. Shut up about the ship war.

There *are* fans who are posting genuinely homophobic and frightening things because they cannot stand that 911 has added another queer couple to the show, and then there are fans who support 911 ABC’s move to expand representation. There *are* fans obsessed with fan fiction fantasies, and then there are fans who simply support canon, on-screen queer representation.

This is so VERY obviously not a ship war. This isn’t “BoBs” vs “Bummys.” This is people who are unable to come to terms with the fact they’ve sold themselves a lie: shipping doesn’t do a damn bit of difference for representation and your obsession isn’t coming true— making it genuinely unsafe to be queer in online 911 spaces.

There is no ship war. “Engaging critically with the internet” means recognizing a pattern of behavior. There is no ship war, but there is a subset of the fandom who refuses to take accountability for what they have encouraged. *You* are the only ones excusing homophobia as “rage bait” and “edgy jokes,” and that’s ultimately the issue. The character is kinda irrelevant when the issue is how you and your followers have so frequently relied on real-world homophobic stereotypes to justify your hate and OOC characterization of a queer character.

911 fans who support the addition of another queer couple and who support Buck’s bi arc have been receiving harassment for months, with other blogs calling them predators, groomers, pedophiles, the n-word, the f-slur, several slurs for women and lesbians, being told to kill themselves, among other things. And you’ve been called—what?—homophobic, racist, sexist?

I know that buddie-stans have also been called out for calling black women “sassy,” for using the mammy trope in your writing, for hypersexualizing Eddie, for harassing the actresses who played previous LIs with misogynistic hate, for writing character-bashing that relies on misogyny, and for NEVER calling this out. Now we can add “vile homophobia” and “frightening violence” to the list.

It’s everyone else’s fault but your own, and yet y’all are the only ones attracting these blogs.

hey guys, heads up if you have anon on, the person who runs the Tommy hate account / wrote the Tommy bashing fic is sending people more of it via ask.

If you see an ask starting with "tommy answers his phone and its Evan" delete it. I also suggest turning anon off if receiving that content would upset you.

i am genuinely a bit scared for my fellow bucktommies because with all the love eyes for bucktommy and tommy, i am not sure if people don't happily-ever-after too close to the sun with their expectations about how the bucktommy relationship will continue. 911 is still very much a drama show that will create drama out of thin air if it has to, oftentimes in ways that feel very dumb and will make the characters look very bad. we have seen in the past that resolutions are usually very lackluster, or sometimes even off screen. i personally really look forward to see buck and tommy, but i hope we all remember that buck AND tommy will fuck up at some point, and maybe even fuck up Bad. please be careful out there with how high you set your expectations, my fellow bucktommies, and don't forget that buck and tommy will have conflict again, with the others or with each other, sooner or later! (i hope it will be compelling and nuanced and interesting conflict that fuels their development, at the very least 🤞 but i also know that i am watching 911 so...)

so nonny, this isn't really directed at you, but i'm gonna use your ask as a springboard cause i'm seeing this sentiment pop up a lot

people need to stop conflating fanon actions with desires for canon

by this i mean, 99% of what i post about bucktommy, are things i never expect to happen in canon, and some of it quite honestly i would not want to happen in canon. i obviously can't speak for everyone, but most of the people i interact with are well aware that the characters on screen are not really the characters we're playing with in our sandbox.

and that's okay. that's how fandom is supposed to work. fandom is separate from the source material. we didn't used to need to post disclaimers about how no, we don't actually think this is going to happen. no, we don't actually think their relationship is going to be sunshine and roses. ppl in fiction act stupid cause sometimes the writer needs stupid to move the plot where they want. I, as a fan, can choose whether to incorporate said stupidity into my existing fanon, whether to analyze it to see how it could fit with my existing fanon, or whether to toss it out, baby and all.

part of the reason fandoms start is because we find the source material lacking. so honestly, when buck or tommy, or any characters, inevitably acts like a dick in a way that seems counter to their previous characterization, it's just more fodder for fandom, a new facet of their character that we then get to analyze and decide why they're doing it. well behaved women rarely make history and well behaved characters rarely make fandoms

so, just so it's clear, at least from me, unless I specifically state that this is what I think will happen in canon, everything I post about bucktommy, and basically all of my fandoms, is not even wishful thinking, it's just me playing with my dolls.

Having Tommy apologize to Hen and Chim about his behavior during the Gerrard-run 118 times twenty years after he already apologized (implied) to them would just seem strange.

The only way we’re going to see that apology is if we get a Tommy Begins episode, which the people who have an issue with Tommy probably wouldn’t want to watch anyways because “ew i don’t want him to have a whole episode dedicated to him??”

They don’t actually care about his actions in the Begins episodes—otherwise they would be able to see that he’s obviously changed and that Chim & Hen wouldn’t hang out or call him if they disliked him or if he hadn’t changed again all—they just want a way to morally justify their hatred for him because, let’s be honest, the people who are weird about Tommy hate him because he isn’t Eddie.

i can't stop thinking about how it's genuinely crazy that antis can't get their arguments straight because like, i do agree with you that tommy's development was rushed and felt shallow. i mean, the reason it felt that way is because tommy wasn't an important character and they probably didn't want to spend time a character on that boiled down to "reformed bully" when they wanted to spend time on main characters. but now he is a vaguely important character and we'll be spending more time on him so it might feel weird not to have more development in that department.

but your argument doesn't really hold a lot of water when 1) you ignore the fact that we did see the fact that tommy changed, just not the journey to how he got to that point, so saying you want him to call someone a slur or assault buck doesn't actually stay true to what the show is showing you his character is and 2) you cannot keep to that argument even if your life depended on it. it's incredibly clear that you don't actually care that much about the rushed development when you keep distracting away from your point with "b-b-but he didn't dress up!!!" and "he made a flirty joke at an inappropriate time!!!" like those things do not matter as much "i genuinely believe that he is still racist, misogynistic, and generally bigoted because we didn't actually see him deconstruct those beliefs"

what… what point are they making here? i binged all of 9-1-1 within two weeks and i never shipped buddie at any point during my first watchthrough. i’ve rewatched all of 9-1-1 since then and still don’t ship buddie.

i like bucktommy bc they have a neat dynamic and want similar things in life, meaning they’re great partners. it also doesn’t help that they’re canon lol. even if they weren’t canon i think i’d still ship them after season 7.

if buddie ever happened i feel like it would crash and burn spectacularly. yknow, with the shannon of it all and that buck and eddie kinda look for two different things in a partner? buck wants a partner. eddie wants a babysitter, yknow?

they really can't fathom that ppl were watching even before s7 and never shipped buddie. like they can't wrap their hands around the concept

meanwhile they won't watch s1 because "what's the point?" don't want to watch if your fave isn't there? the same thing you baselessly accuse bucktommy fans of?

is it cause they would see that eddie was not in fact the catalyst for buck's growth?

Anyway Tommy was more queer coded in the three begins eps than Eddie ever has been in six seasons lol

I GIVE UP.

I just read the most asinine thing I think I've read this week... and I've been on Buddie twitter.

"masc4masc men are literally always so evil and more often than not, intensely homophobic."

Intensely homophobic you say? Kinda like that comment.

Stating that we don't need more masc4masc representation in the media is a fucking take. Literally stupid as hell. We have VERY little masc4masc representation in the media... especially when it comes to bisexual men.

I don't know who needs to hear this but: "femme" and "twink" are not synonymous with "bottom".

Also, for someone y'all claim to hate so much, you certainly do spend an awful lot of time thinking about him. That's fan behavior.

I will say, however, that you are right. Eddie is not masc4masc, because he's fucking straight. Hope that helps. 🥰

Hope this helps 🫶🏾❤️

I'm trying so hard to stop posting about dumbass discourse but

this is painfully ironic coming from the group of people who, instead of celebrating bucks coming out arc, turned toxic and hateful the second they realized he wasn't going to date the "right" man. think you may be projecting a bit bud

saying this when multiple gay men explained the rhetoric against tommy was becoming homophobic and said homophobia was defended because the people perpetrating it were lesbians and this allowed to hate men? fuck off

my dash is pretty quiet so is this a good time to say something highly controversial?

I need the bestie boos to fucking THINK.

This shit started in season 7 when death threats were sent to Tim. Over a certain scene. Then, Lou gets treated like shit, you guys made JLH get emotional on an Instagram live because you yelled at her AFTER she said, "I really don't think the Buck and Eddie thing is going to happen guys. I think we need to let it go."

In a live with Kenny, he said "Eddie and Buck? Looks like it's not going to happen, looks like it's the Tommy/Buck show, don't you think?"

Lou's sister got harassed, Tim's messages got shared in a gotcha, everyone wants to bring up Lou's past Instagram posts or Ryan's past lives, three internet trolls have to constantly tag cast and crew in every damn "horrible" thing someone does that goes against Buddie, some sick fuck wrote csa fics and purposely tagged them wrong just so they could traumatize others.

You use slurs, you harass anyone connected to the show, everything is a damn joke to you.

You get a picture of Aisha, Oliver and Ryan. And what do you do? You gloat. You make fun of people who like Tommy with Buck and call the actor jobless.

And then last night, Oliver shares a picture from his trailer and you unhinged freaks bitched and moaned and threatened violence in not one, not three, but SIX DIFFERENT INBOXES.

Oliver. Lou. Tim. 911 insta. Ryan. ABC.

And in a move so vengeful one of you crossed the line and now we're here.

So please tell me how it makes no sense to protect the talent, to phase out buddie propaganda, to show that mustache 50 times a week and to delete hateful comments.

You've made your fanon bed, now lie down, shut tf up, and suffer the consequences.

I……. don’t think person has watched the show? Like. At all??

This is the last I'm sharing of this Bestie boo.

To even have the courage to hop online and even say something like this yet alone have the thought form in your head is insane. Please log off of social media. Go talk to real life people and actually experience real life things.

You people are losers and I genuinely hope that this show continues to disappoint and deprive you of whatever causes you to spread this kind of hate and weirdness.

Obviously I don't ascribe to the "who wears the pants" lens of looking at a relationship, but all this new disk horse makes me laugh a little because ...because...because you look at Evan Buck Buckley and Eddie Diaz side by side and you give EDDIE the feminine role in a theoretical relationship? Eddie Diaz, Mr-Toxic-Masculinity-but-only-as-it-pertains-to-myself? Eddie Diaz, who blew up his own life because he has been so dead set on following a traditional set of 'rules' for relationships? Eddie Diaz who canonically likes to watch pro-fights and participate in street fights and fuck around under hoods of classic cars and ties himself in KNOTS any time he experiences One emotion?

Like if you're gonna be weird as fuck and hetero-normative and assign gender based roles that don't actually NEED to have a place in a queer relationship (unless that's a thing you're into) then BUCK is your femme. If we're looking at them through that lens, Buck is the one who loves and is great with children, who loves cooking and providing for his family (in more than just a 'man the grill' way), who puts himself into the role of caretaker and put himself in therapy bc he recognized how deeply his issues ran.

IMHO the Eddie as femme read is based ENTIRELY on physical attributes which makes it EVEN WEIRDER.

All of this to say neither one of them is required to present as femme in any way shape or form because that has nothing to do with mlm. If your read on Eddie has any lick of queer in it please for the love of god stop trying to assign gender roles to his queerness and his attraction.

Even if the point is to sort of flip the script on the role they have outside the bedroom you're doing it wrong.

🤨

This person was overall very normal about their dissertation they wrote, so I’m not calling them out personally.

But, I need people to realize this this:

is not what queer coding is.

While yes, queer coding does include deliberate subtext implying that a character is queer, that interview was not that.

The point of queer coding in media is for it to be obvious—without saying the words—that a character is queer, not just a select group of people who are interpreting things how they want them. It is generally used in tandem with queer stereotypes, but it doesn’t have to be—this part is mostly associated with negative stereotypes, which is why most Disney villains are queer coded.

Eddie, unlike Buck, has never been queer coded. He’s never interacted with Buck, or another man, in a way that infers he’s attracted to them, even subconsciously. Figuring out “who the hell he is” is Tim speak for he needs to find Jesus (literally and figuratively).

When certain Buddie fans nitpick at his “queer coding” they’re usually attributing his negative actions to his, yet undiscovered, alleged queerness. Because, if he’s not a repressed gay, then he’s just a misogynist. *gasp*

The alleged coding you attribute to him in giving him Disney villain vibes and, no me gusta.

I do hope Eddie gets a chance to shine and becomes a better person; however, he is not and will not be gay when he learns how to live for himself so that he can live for his son too.

In this essay I will….

they're still "joking" about killing the gay character btw