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(BOOK ONLY) Since some stupid people have come into this fandom, everything you hear makes you think whether they are just stupid or pretending to be stupid.

"Alicent did everything for 20 years while Rhaenyra was vacationing on Dragonstone"

The princess of Dragonstone living in dragonstone!??? Oh the misery😱😮 Are you hearing yourself? Like be serious right now.

It is the seat of the heir, the Prince/Princess of DRAGONSTONE. Dragonstone is her seat, where she rules. Until she becomes Queen where the seat will pass on to her hair and the next after that. As Prince of Dragonstone Rhaegar along with his family lived on Dragonstone.

She ruled on Dragonstone. After being heir and cupbearer before her marriage for years. And no she wasn't simply sitting on her ass and having sex and fun and vacationing as some of you put it. She had duties to be done, holding courts, hosting guests and visitors. It wasn't just some small island with no island either, it was an overlord to, House Velaryon, House Celtigar, House Bar Emmon, and House Sunglass(what a name). And she had to host those who were guests coming to pay respects and hear their problems and what not. And none of these mean that she was simply gone from Kingslanding either, it takes an hour? on dragon back to get there. We do know she was there present in some ways, the rivalry between her sons and Alicent's, her and Maester Gerardys coming to heal Viserys.

"And in these 20 years, Aegon bettered himself to rule."

Girl where? We know nothing of him from ages 6-12?. Afterwards, all we know of this time is he was fondling maids, fucking servantmaids and whore, getting drunk and spending his time in the streets of silk and that he was having bastards even after being married to a princess and having children. They literally found him in a brothel with a whore, while bringing him news of his father's death.

“-If you cry, I will let you go. - he warned her. - So, no tears. You are a dragon, and dragons do not cry and fear like regular men. We are more than that, princess.”

….

“In King’s Landing, Viserys sat with Rhaenyra as he told her everything. Her mother’s death, and her brother’s as well. She sat stoically and listened to him quietly.

….

“When she looked at her reflection in the mirror she felt older and sad, but she did not cry, not then, and not when the flames consumed the body that had once belonged to her mother-”

Excerpts From

The Rogue Prince

SweetestPopcorn

Personally, I've always perceived Rhaenyra as an entitled brat. That was sort of how she was portrayed in the book. Daemon was pretty nasty as well, as he groomed Rhaenyra. He was teaching her "how best to touch a man to bring him pleasure," if Mushroom is to be believed.

I am inclined to believe Mushroom.

I think most of Rhaenyra's behaviors at Daemon's fault, but I do think that Rhaenyra is mad as she wanted to torture her little brother for calling her bastard children 'bastards'. That isn't sane behavior, and nothing really excuses it. Aemond really was defending himself.

Alicent should have asked for Rhaenyra's boys to be swatted on the hands wooden spoon a good few times, not an eye. (Lucerys should not have had a dagger. Why would a child need a dagger?)

I don't think anyone thought Rhaenyra was still heir after Aegon was born. Viserys literally broke the laws of the entire realm for her.

War was inevitable, and there was nothing Rhaenyra could have done aside from marrying her infant brother.

I don't know if you've been asked something like this before. I also have no idea if the background to my question makes sense, but do you think there was any way Rhaenyra could have become Queen without breaking laws, murdering kin, and or bloodshed?

Who started breaking laws? —The Greens

Who started murdering kin?—The Greens

Who started bloodshed?— The Greens

In a monarchy, which Westeros is and has been for THOUSANDS of years the king's words is the law. Not that of his predecessors, but of the present ruling monarch.

Viserys named his 8 year old daughter as his heir, he varied from custom yes, but never broke law. HE IS THE LAW.

Viserys also broke custom by marrying Alicent, a daughter of a second son and not a ruling lord. A woman that could not give him anything of importance, not money, not a fleet, not any great allegiance. He married her simply because loved her. Being the second time he broke CUSTOM for a woman he loved. Rhaenyra and Alicent.

Even if Viserys allowed his 16 year old daughter to be wed to her 6 year old brother, you think that would prevent war? You people are simply stupid if you think so. Aegon (Otto & Alicent) could easily imprison Rhaenyra and simply put it out as she died, or simply even just end her life. And obviously with their children being young(if they had any, very unlikely) Aegon could crown himself as king rather than prince consort. And do you really think Alicent would let her precious son be king consort to a wanton woman? We see this with Jaehaerys' children Daenerys and Aemon.

I don't think anyone thought Rhaenyra was still heir after Aegon was born. Viserys literally broke the laws of the entire realm for her.

The Blacks? Literally many at court more than even the Greens supported Rhaenyra as heir. Even afterwards, during the war Rhaenyra had much more supporters than Aegon, even after her death.

Rhaenyra is mad as she wanted to torture her little brother for calling her bastard children 'bastards'. That isn't sane behavior, and nothing really excuses it. Aemond really was defending himself. Alicent should have asked for Rhaenyra's boys to be swatted on the hands wooden spoon a good few times, not an eye.

Right, Rhaenyra insisting for Aemond to be questioned sharply is mad but Alicent asking for a five year old's eye to be cut out is perfectly sane behaviour, yes? Be serious right now. Do you really think Viserys out of all people would let his son be tortured? Rhaenyra knew of that, she wanted Aemond to admit that his mother, Alicent has been spreading rumours abt easy as that.

It wasn't just for the insults either, Luke's nose was broken, Jace was hit in the head. And Joff was thrown into dragon droppings.

Afraid that the boy would raise the alarm, Prince Aemond shouted at him to be quiet, then shoved him backward into a pile of dragon droppings.

Aemond fought back, breaking Luke’s nose with a punch, then wrenching the sword from Joff’s hands and cracking it across the back of Jace’s head, driving him to his knees. As the younger boys scrambled back away from him, bloody and bruised, the prince began to mock them, laughing and calling them “the Strongs.”

Jace at least was old enough to grasp the insult. He flew at Aemond once again, but the older boy began pummeling him savagely…until Luke, coming to the rescue of his brother, drew his dagger and slashed Aemond across the face, taking out his right eye.

Aemond was TEN. Jace was SIX, Luke FIVE, Joff only THREE.

A 10 year old Pummeling (= boxing, repeatedly puching) and 6 year old is a perfectly good thing to do.

Lucerys should not have had a dagger. Why would a child need a dagger?

Because this child, is a prince? Almost everyone had daggers at that time, Kings, Queens, Princes, Princesses, Ladies, Lords, Commonborn, every one had daggers. They carried it for personal protection, even Lucerys.

Не was teaching her "how best to touch a man to bring him pleasure," if Mushroom is to be believed. I am inclined to believe Mushroom.

Even then, if Rhaenyra is such an 'entitled brat' why would she want to please the son of a steward of a Lord. And that too, not even a major Lord. Why would she want to please a no-one that became a someone because of HER.

Personally, I've always perceived Rhaenyra as an entitled brat. That was sort of how she was portrayed in the book.

She was portrayed as spoiled, yes. How could she not be? She came after many miscarriages and stillbirth, many other losses in the family. To her parents she was their first daughter, both of them motherless on their own. To Baelon, she was his first granddaughter after the loss of this wife, son, aemon and the rest of his siblings. To Jaehaerys and Alysanne, she was probably the first great-grandchild they met, she came after they lost most of their children (+Jocelyn who was as good as daughter, Rhaenys and probably never met her children till the feast and tourney of 98). She was a light in a time where her family was sinking from the inside.

I don't know how fighting for something that is yours, and have been for over TWENTY YEARS is seen as entitlement rather advocating and defending her own right?

There is someone who is portrayed as entitled, however. Alicent Hightower. Who thought simply because she popped out the King's son, means he should become a king. And this son who thought simply because he was a man with a cock, he was more fit to rule than a daughter without a cock.

Why should I explain the basic of things to strangers as if they're 5 and lack comprehension? Lol😭

Alicent had her children didn't ask to be in this inbred snakepit.

So Alicent Hightower fell in love and married an inbred man, fucked him and had four inbred children. Two of them went on to get married to each other and had three inbred children of their own, Alicent's grandchildren. These inbred grandchildren would've been married to each other had they lived too. But again, I'm making all of these up, right? None of these happened? Just in my delusional mind, right? Dude be fucking serious right now.

Also it was a dragonpit, it only became a snakepit once Alicent came in.

Alicent is a political mastermind whether you like her or not. Her keeping the peace after visits died is why Rhaenyra lived as long as she did

Lol, which part of her character screams political mastermind to you? The part where she was having petty grudges against a pre-teen? Or the part where she spread unnecessary rumours abt the said 12/13 year old? Or the part where she publicly hated the same child? Or the last where she wanted a 5 year old's eye to be put out? Or the part where her 19 and 15 year old sons remained unwed, instead of creating an allegiance?

She is smart and cunning and ambitious but not in the most political way.

Her marriage was the utmost political move on her part. Through this marriage, she became queen, one of the most powerful titles, had four princelings and three to follow after them.

I do think the Rhaenyra & Alicent mostly animosity mostly began after Otto was sent away(109)/Aemond was born(110), which would put Alicent(21/22) displaying public dislike towards Rhaenyra(12/13). Everyone and their mothers in the court knew abt their 'animosity' towards each other even before the tourney of 111 AC, blacks and greens were formed. Alicent was 23 and Rhaenyra was 14.

“Ser Criston protects the princess from her enemies, but who protects the princess from Ser Criston?” Queen Alicent asked one day at court. Such a political movie on Alicent's part🤦‍♀️

Taking in Lord Commander of the Kingsgaurd Criston, was a power gaining move on her past however. But then again, a man she alleged of being a pedo when she had a silver haired daughter herself. So, again, who knows.

Aegon and Helaena marriage was arranged by Viserys, so it would calm down Aegon a bit (from whoring and drinking). She as a mother did not stop Aegon from whoring or excessive drinking, even though she wanted him to be king. She did not prepare him to rule or have someone do it, just let him sire bastards and destroy his reputation. Just because he was a son, he was the better choice, even with nothing to back it.

Queen Alicent demanded that one of Lucerys Velaryon’s eyes should be put out, for the eye he had cost Aemond. Luke was FIVE when this happened, Alicent was a grown 32 year old woman, a mother to 4 children. Though this can easily be passed as her mother's grief talking. So moving on.

Aemond(19) and Daeron(15) remained unwed. Marriage is the best way of allegiance (ex. Rhaenyra and Velaryons). Aemond could've been easily married by then, maybe to Cassandra Baratheon, where he could've been her consort (ex. Daemon and Rhea). Daeron could've been married too, but even a Betrothal would've been fine, maybe to some Tyrell. Yet it didn't happen.

By (visits=Viserys?) 'Rhaenyra living as long as she did', I think you mean the peace treaty? Even an idiot knows you offer a peace treaty at the beginning of a war, so you can be seen as peaceful and better than the other. It wasn't even just her either, Otto and Helaena both pushed for it. The offer was also a hostageship for Rhaenyra and her whole family.

Also Rhaenyra is the one who kept Alicent alive not the other way around. “for the sake of our father, who loved you once.”

I know the genie is out of the bottle and you can't go back but dear GOD I hate the mainstreamification of fandom so much

I do NOT want authors or showrunners or actors to acknowledge us or talk about fanfic or fanart or fan theories! I do NOT want people asking questions of the canon creators and getting them answered (make up your own answers, like god intended!) I do NOT want companies making jokey advertisements aimed toward fandom!

I know that fandom was never entirely underground but like... I miss that fourth wall existing, you know?

Baby Aegon traumatized from day 1 out of the womb XD

Well if they didn't have ambitions all the Hightowers and their targaryen children would've all been dead. Alicent's ambition is the only thing that kept her children alive. Hope this helps.

Right...... Which one of her children did she keep alive again? Lol you people truly do say whatever comes to your mind huh. Viserys kept them alive. She killed her children, is the sentence you should've typed out. But then again, with her political inexpertise and incompetence no one can blame her.

'All the Hightowers would've been dead', girl they're an irrelevant house, no one gives a shit abt them:).

Lil Sketch of Baby! Aegon and Baby! Viserys at Driftmark

[I for some reason thought they were wearing winter clothing and re-read the scene only to realize I was wrong but I was in to deep so I just committed 😭]

Princess Viserra Targaryen

Daughter of King Jaehaerys and Queen Alysanne.

(why yes, I did redo Viserra. Why do you ask?)

Rhaenyra wasn't usurped because she was a woman, she was usurped because she was a stupid woman. If she had kept her leg closed and didn't have BASTARDS she wouldn't have been so opposed throughout the Realm

Saying she wasn't usurped because of misogyny while spewing misogyny is quite funny.

It was never abt her having bastards to begin with. It is and was always abt her being a woman and not having a sausage between her legs.

In the many many drafts of the dance, in one she married a lannister and had no children, but still got usurped. In an other, rhaenyra was married to a lyonel strong, and she still got usurped.

The problem is not her children, or whether she kept her legs close, but that she is a woman.

And let us say it was about bastards, do you really think Daemon would let them live? Let his sons that he has waited for years get passed down. Daemon did love Rhaenyra, but he had his own ambitions and motives. I don't think he would do it publicly simply because of his love for Rhaenyra. But a simple fall, accidental drowning, an assassin, it's all very possible.

It was abt the Hightowers and Alicent's ambitions.

Hope this helps🙂

モデル:2号

If you're still taking requests, please do Viserra. Decked out in purples, and red and golds in Kingslanding OR she reluctantly marries Lord Theomore Manderly and only wears black as if in constant mourning, so fully decked out black and rubies🥹. Hope you have a good day. Take care. Thank you!!!!

Viserra req 1

art raffle for 100 followers ! :-) thank you so much for the support!

rules:

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optional: tell me anything about your favourite character - as a reply, a retweet, in my inbox etc anywhere you want ..

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ends on the 20th!

This is so Aemma and Rhaenyra. Maybe Aemma telling Rhaenyra she's going to have a new sibling😫🥹. Before it all goes wrong.

Artist: Jan Portielje

Title: A song sweetly sung

✨ The Young Princess Rhaenyra  ✨

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“-The dragon doesn’t become sick, Baela. Your mother’s illness has far happier a cause. Both you and your sister will know it after you are wed.

Baela looked at her uncle as if he was telling her a second pair of arms would sprout from her torso. Even Rhaena seemed to mislike his words and Aegon and Viserys were as confused as their sisters.”

————— The Blacks & the greens by Sweetestpopcorn

Daemon will soon know not to mess with his children or they will steal away their mama XD

Anyway let me post this insanity here I've rarely been so proud - inspired by Avatar the Last Airbender (Princess Yue, Fire Lord Ozai & Avatar Kyoshi all melted together) cause it's become relevant lately & I love that lil cartoon 😙🤍💚🩵❤️

"she has grieved for a brother and a husband and a son..."

It's a redraw of this old Daenerys art (one of my very first 😊)

In your opinion, would Princess Viserra's fate have changed if she had been promised to Lord Manderly's heir, and not to him?

That is to say, if marriage to the Manderlys were necessary to formalize a pact with the North, perhaps a handsome husband of the same age who would make her Lady of White Harbor would be more interesting to the young princess.

I won't hold back. NOTHING about Viserra's storyline makes any sense short of all the characters having a stroke.

Perceptive and compassionate Alysanne, who previously demonstrated considerable matchmaking skills, suddenly becomes very bad at it. (Don't get me started on Elio Garcia's attempt to defend Alysanne's OOC behavior as her being jealous of her own daughter's beauty.)

Jaehaerys suddenly becomes an absentee father from the 1950s rather than, you know, a medieval king for whom his daughter's marriage is of the utmost political importance.

Septon Barth? Grand Maester Elysar? Both MIA.

Theomore Manderly? If he was truly canny, he would have seen the offer for what it was and declined it.

Its true, the best way to tie the North closer to the south (and more specifically the Iron Throne) short of House Stark is House Manderly. However, marrying Viserra, a princess (and the prettiest one at that) to Theomore entirely defeats that purpose. One, a fat man old enough to be your grandfather is hardly appealing on a personal level, especially to a teen princess who knows just how attractive she is. Two, any children Viserra had would come behind four wives' worth of stepchildren, practically guaranteeing that the future Lords of White Harbor won't share any direct blood ties to House Targaryen, which brings me to my third point. Marrying Viserra to Theomore more or less dooms Viserra's line to obscurity and she herself to a life of dependency on the charity of her stepson.

What, then, would have made way more sense? Marrying her to Desmond, who, as Theomore's great-grandson, would probably be fairly close in age to her, not to mention higher in the succession.

Now, to answer your question, yes I absolutely do believe Viserra might have lived a longer (and perhaps even fulfilling) life if her parents had picked someone other than Theomore Manderly to be her husband. Remember, the whole reason she was even out and about the night of her death was because she wanted to have fun one last time before resigning herself to her fate. If she had instead been looking forward to her wedding she wouldn't have had any incentive to sneak out, which makes the chances of her suffering a tragic accident the way she did in OTL astronomically lower.

Thanks for the question, @diegoedil

I genuinely do not understand how people think Rhaenyra wasn't usurped because she was a woman.

What quality does Aegon have that Rhaenyra doesn't aside from being a son?

Rhaenyra is older, and therefore more experienced. Has been the Princess of Dragonstone since she was EIGHT. Took hold and started ruling since SIXTEEN. She knows more about governing than the rest of her four half siblings combined. She has been her father, the King's cupbearer since before being named heir. Has followed her father almost everywhere since he became king. Attended meeting and counsels and all of the things relating to governorship.

Aegon had a princely tutorship, but what else? This man spent his adult(and teen) life in the streets of silk. Aside from his basic education as a prince, what else does he know? Viserys wasn't going to bother, since Aegon isn't even the second in line to the throne, it is Jace, has been since Aegon was 7. Otto wasn't even present till Aegon was atleast 13. Alicent wasn't an active ruler or decision maker like Alysanne was, so obviously not her either.

It wasn't for the lack of supporters either. Out of the six great houses of Westeros, Stark, Arryn, Tully, Lannister, Baratheon, Tyrell, THREE supported her. TWO supported Aegon. ONE, the Tyrells remained neutral, simply because most of their bannermen supported the greens. She was more loved and known throughout the realm.

about the ages and timeline I don't know if you're referring to the fact that the actors of Alicent, Aegon, Aemond and Helaena are in the same age range (olivia cooke and tom are 29 and 30 years old WTF) or the fact that no one ages in this series, two time jumps and corlys, rhaenys, otto, alicent and criston are the same

All of it. Like what even abt that show makes sense. How do people make it make sense. Like Princess Karen was 50 when her children were 10? She's still 50 when her ADULT children die and have almost adult grandchildren. Ser Hightower looked the same all throughout they didn't even try. Not going to speak abt Alisaint, there's no point in it. The creators have their bias towards that woman. Like they aren't even trying to hide the fact that Alisaint is their best and favourite character🤷‍♀️.

THE UGLY ASS COSTUMES. THE TERRIBLE SCRIPT. THE NO THINKING OF SENSE THAT WENT INTO THE MISERABLE PLOT.

After that fanfic shitshow came out, the illiterate people who genuinely can't comprehend or grasp the littlest of things in this fandom have SKYROCKETED.

Just going to leave this here 😭😭😭😭😂

happy to know that I'm not the only one who thinks HOTD is mediocre, why make an adaptation if it would change absolutely everything in the book? alicent and rhaenyra are not the characters we have in the book and anyone who thinks this is good is a little dumb

It's far from mediocre actually. Alisaint and Renada and every single characters in that fanfic shitshow are whole new characters with the same name with personalities from other characters. And somehow it's seen as 'better'. I don't understand what abt badly written and half completed characters are so much better. Don't get me started on the age and timelines.

Queen Alicent Hightower

«Do keep trying, sir Laenor, soon or late, you may get one who looks like you.»