Classpect Profile Guide

Classpect Profile Guide

In my previous post, I posited a theory that all standard classes and aspects can describe an individual, beyond the Hero Title and subrole.

Here's a step-by-step process of how to determine a Classpect Profile, all 12 roles. I will use myself as an example.

1) Divide the aspects into 6 complementary pairs/opposites:

Space & Time

Light & Void

Hope & Rage

Heart & Mind

Breath & Blood

Life & Doom

2) Look at each individual aspect, and consider how you typically interact with it. (See Aspect Keywords post for reference. bladekindeyewear and infinitywhale go into more depth here and here.)

For interactions, here are some keywords for class types:

Manipulate/Change (Witch/Heir)

Understand (Mage/Seer)

Destroy (Prince/Bard)

Create (Maid/Sylph)

Redistribute (Thief/Rogue)

Apply (Knight/Page)

You can also use these keywords for individual classes:

Control (Witch)       Influence (Heir)Experience (Mage)       Study (Seer)Demolish (Prince)       Deconstruct (Bard)Generate (Maid)       Mend (Sylph)Take (Thief)       Share (Rogue)Exploit (Knight)       Empower (Page)

3) Next to each aspect, write the class keywords you think might fit. You should be able to narrow each aspect down to a few potential keywords.

(Note: I recommend starting with the 6 class type keywords instead of the 12 unique ones because it paints a larger picture of the class themes, but if you’re confident (or feel lazy), feel free to start with the 12. You can also mix and match, but just be sure to distinguish types from individual keywords, or it may become confusing down the line. For the purposes of this guide, I’ll start with the 6.)

Possibilities, in my case:

4) Eliminate any keyword that doesn’t have an inverse under an opposite aspect. Inverse keywords are Manipulate & Understand, Destroy & Create, and Redistribute & Apply.

For example, in my case, Manipulate and Redistribute Space don’t have inverses—Understand and Apply—for Time, Space’s opposite, so I can remove them as possibilities.

Narrowed results:

5) Split the class type keywords into individual class (–/+) keywords.

For example, Apply, keyword for Warrior classes, divides into keywords Exploit (Knight) and Empower (Page).

(Note: If you started with the 12 individual keywords, Steps 5 and 6 aren’t necessary.)

6) Narrow your results by removing any class keywords that don’t fit your interactions with an aspect.

7) From there, eliminate class keywords without an inverse keyword for its opposite aspect, just as before. Inverses are Control & Study, Influence & Experience, Demolish & Mend, Deconstruct & Generate, Take & Empower, Share & Exploit.

For example, in my case, Mend Space doesn’t have an opposite Demolish Time, so I eliminate Mend.

8) Use the process of elimination to figure out the rest. No duplicate keywords/classes are allowed, so remove any duplicates of those already solved.

(Note: All class keywords will be used, so if you’re missing any, you’ll have to go back and reconsider your options.)

For example, in the previous step, I narrowed Light and Void to Influence and Experience. That means I can’t use Influence or Experience for Hope and Rage, which narrows Hope and Rage to Mend and Demolish. Likewise, I narrowed Heart and Mind to Empower and Take, because those were the only instances I had of those class keywords.

Simple process of elimination narrowed my results considerably! Most of them are solved!

That just leaves two classpect pairs I’m unsure about, or 4 total.

9) For any remaining pairs left to solve, look at each class description more closely…

…And figure out which descriptions most accurately fit your interaction with each aspect.

In my case, I feel like Knight fits better than Maid for Space, which narrows Space and Time to Knight and Rogue, respectively.

I still can’t determine Breath and Blood, as Maid and Bard both seem fitting. I use dahniwitchoflight’s Aspect posts as a guide, looking at descriptions for all four. Bard of Breath sounds especially like me, and Maid of Blood more than Bard of Blood.

10) Convert the keywords back into classes, and that’s it! You’ve now determined your full Classpect Profile!

I like using my Classes Chart and Aspect Keywords to create a brief description of each of my 12 roles.

Example:

Seer of Life: Invites understanding of/with/through Life (life force, energy, growth, power, persistence, wealth, boldness, enthusiasm, efficacy), guiding others.

All 12 seem pretty accurate to me!

How to determine a Hero Title and subrole Look at which aspect pair has the strongest influence on your actions and perspective. Most likely, it will also match the dual class pair that most accurately describes how you naturally operate in general. Both class and aspect are important to consider, especially if you have difficulty narrowing either down to one pair.

One of those classpects will sound like you at your best; it’s your area of greatest potential and method of having a maximum impact on reality. Its opposite/inverse classpect is your primary focus when you are stressed and in an unhealthy frame of mind, yet it’s also something you can put to good use. You’re probably naturally skilled with both classpects.

Your Hero Title is your best, ideal, and healthiest state, and your subrole is the stressed-but-useful state. Sometimes it’s easier to figure out your subrole first and invert it to discover your Title.

As for me, I am a Seer of Life! My subrole is Witch of Doom.

Alternate possibilities? If you’re not fond of your Hero Title, go with the alternate roles that have the next strongest influence in your life. Most likely, these will be the classpect pairs in which you can easily distinguish a “healthy” role and an inverse “unhealthy” role.

In my case, Heir of Light Mage of Void and Sylph of Hope are strong alternate Hero Titles. (Ugh, why do my top three aspects have to be the color schemes I most dislike? Void is awesome.)

Using an alternate role won’t be as ideal as your primary role, but it’s still a useful option.

Now what? After you’ve determined your Classpect Profile and Hero Title, I highly recommend learning more about each of your 12 roles in Dahni’s Aspect posts. Then use your Classpect Profile however you like!

I hope this guide was helpful and informative!

Terezi is NOT going to have Vriska’s death retconned

Yes, Terezi regrets killing her, but more significantly, she realizes she was cornered into that choice and wonders, had she been thinking clearly and known all the facts, had any thoughts or circumstances changed, would there have been more options? Would killing Vriska be the only way to stop her?

GC: 1 K33P WOND3R1NG 1F TH3R3 W4S 4NOTH3R W4Y GC: SOM3TH1NG OTH3R TH4N L3TT1NG H3R GO, OR K1LL1NG H3R

GC: WH3N 1 CONFRONT3D H3R, 4ND 1T W4S T1M3 TO M4K3 UP MY M1ND GC: 1 THOUGHT 1 H4D 1T 4LL F1GUR3D OUT, L1K3 TH1S W4S WH4T 1 H4D TO DO. NOT JUST TO S4V3 3V3RYBODY, BUT 4S SOM3 STUP1D R1T3 OF P4SS4G3 OR SOM3TH1NG? GC: TH3N 1T C4M3 T1M3 TO DO 1T, 4ND 1T W4S 4LL H4PP3N1NG SO F4ST... GC: 4ND 1 FORC3D MY OWN H4ND. 1 COULD 31TH3R L3T 3V3RYON3 D13 1N ON3 R34L1TY, OR K1LL 4 FR13ND 1N 4NOTH3R GC: 4ND 1 T3LL MYS3LF THOS3 W3R3 TH3 ONLY TWO VORT1C3S 1 S4W... GC: BUT TH3N, 1 W4S TH3 ON3 WHO M4D3 TH3 S3R13S OF D3C1S1ONS WH1CH L3D UP TO TH4T CHO1C3, 4ND COMPL3T3LY P41NT3D TH3 OPT1ONS 1NTO TH4T CORN3R

TEREZI: 4ND NOW 1T F33LS L1K3 TH3 ONLY "H3RO1C" TH1NG 1 3V3R D1D W1TH THOS3 POW3RS TEREZI: W4S US3 TH3M TO JUST1FY K1LL1NG MY FR13ND [...] TEREZI: 4ND WH4TS WORS3 1S TEREZI: TO TH1S D4Y, 1M ST1LL NOT 3V3N TOT4LLY SUR3 1F 1T W4S N3C3SS4RY [...] KARKAT: WELL, YEAH. OF COURSE IT WAS NECESSARY. KARKAT: EVEN IF IT WASN'T THE MORALLY RIGHT CHOICE OR WHATEVER, IT WAS OBVIOUSLY SOMETHING THAT HAD TO HAPPEN. [...] KARKAT: IT'S SIMPLE. IF YOU HADN'T KILLED HER, YOU WOULD HAVE WITHERED AWAY IN A DOOMED TIMELINE.

Maybe, in the end, these retcons reinforce to Terezi that indeed, killing Vriska is the only viable option, and she makes that decision with a clear mind and of her own accord—not one limited by Rage. By knowing Vriska is responsible for Tavros' death and not all the others, as well as no longer viewing their confrontation as a JUST1C3 role-playing game of sorts, Terezi will no longer have lingering doubts and regrets, and instead embrace her role as a Seer of Mind.

If the retcons are geared toward this intent, they wouldn't so much undo events as undo Terezi's outlook and attitude—her depression,  self-hatred, and rejection of her role. Really, only events post-Cascade and events revolving around Terezi would change. And there weren't even that many of those during the meteor trip.

But here's the main reason nothing significant will change pre-Cascade: Doc Scratch's narration.

The Seer of Mind had challenged the Thief of Light to a simple game of chance. If the result was the undamaged side, the Thief would agree to stay. If not, she would "go." [...] The actual result was trivial; it was a constant across all timelines. [...] The Thief used her abilities to steal the fortune of her opponent, and forced the flip to yield what she regarded as the most favorable outcome. The Seer anticipated this move, correctly.

I've never much enjoyed navigating the vortices of alternative possibility. The path which alone has my absolute mastery is the alpha timeline, a continuum I define as that which boasts exclusive rights both to my birth and to my death, two circumstantially simultaneous events. Any divergence from this path to my knowing will taper into blackness like rotting roots.

(Bold emphasis mine.)

Why is this information significant? The Alpha Timeline seems to have already taken John's retcons into consideration. So far, all events as known from Caliborn's perspective, like John dying in an explosion and his "ghost" returning periodically to haunt him, seem to be accurate post-retcon information. (Of course, this is also assuming the Jade and Jane hanging out with Calliope are from the same and Alpha timeline.)

If retcons don't change or contradict Caliborn's knowledge, I would think this concept would extend to Doc Scratch, as well, considering his omniscience and influence. Undoing Vriska's death would dramatically change his story.

Not to mention, it would change this:

But it is the desecration of a priceless timepiece where I must draw the line. I'm afraid I must now insist that you take your beating quite personally.

Events that directly affect and influence Doc Scratch, Spades Slick, and the destruction of the universe leading to the creation of the Green Sun.

The one way events could change is if Doc Scratch is playing a rare prank. If that is the case, Terezi doesn't need to kill Vriska, but someone else does in order for the god tier clock-related events to occur. An escaped Gamzee would be the likely culprit.

Regardless, Vriska still has to die Justly, or too many crucial events change.

Vriska's Return and the Alpha Timeline's Fate

There is something downright ominous about Vriska’s return. Something about it just seems so foreboding and …wrong.

It brings to mind John’s reaction to Caliborn’s retelling of events in “Homosuck”:

Her return is so ominous, evidence suggests that John will eventually retcon his retcon to restore the original Alpha Timeline.

But what makes Vriska’s return so foreboding? What significance will this new Alpha Timeline have upon reality? And why must John undo this change?

Overview of Topics:

Personal growth

Terezi’s inverted behavior

Characters’ meta-awareness

Retcons, void timelines, and semi-stable retcon loops

Caliborn’s statements

Doc Scratch’s omniscience

Alt!Calliope

Gamzee’s importance

Vriska’s Thief of Light and Page of Void roles

Horses: the Ultimate Bad Omen

Vriska’s return is disturbing because it undoes all the experiences and personal growth the heroes have undergone for the past three years on their journey through the Furthest Ring. The very notion contradicts something in story Hussie himself emphasized as important:

They have to face all those issues themselves, or they will never learn and grow as people. […] The journey itself is more important than the destination. The struggle is what builds character and teaches us about ourselves and about life.

He elaborates, comparing Trickster Mode shenanigans to Mario using a Star to overcome obstacles:

But the point is, [Mario] didn't really win. That magic star was actually devastating to his development as a human being. WHY. Because he skipped over many critical trials on his spiritual journey. Mario NEEDS to stomp on all those mushrooms. He NEEDS to bonk those bricks with his head, for the sake of his personal growth. By using the star, he is denying himself many powerful moments of catharsis.

This idea very much applies to John’s retcon powers and using them to change the Alpha Timeline, the events of the story. Like Trickster Mode and Mario's Star, retconning seems like an easy fix, a cheap, deus ex machina solution. It’s cheating. Dave even states, “messing with the alpha timeline [...] almost seems heretical.” Solving problems by retconning them out of existence is ineffectual and does not lead to growth.

By Terezi having John reset the timeline, undoing Vriska’s death, many of the characters will no longer face the challenges and hardships they previously would have. Terezi undoes the guilt that torments her, her abusive relationship with Gamzee, and the healing of her eyesight.

It is absolutely understandable that Terezi would want to do this! How many people wish they could undo something in their lives, especially mistakes they deeply regret making? How many people would change these mistakes if given the capability? However, in doing so, Terezi is denying herself the opportunity to grow and to heal from these experiences.

The events of our lives and the actions we take shape, define, and refine who we are as individuals. By having John retcon Vriska’s death, Terezi is essentially changing who she is and who she will become. Consequently, she’s changing who the other characters are, as well. Terezi is acting as a Witch of Heart, one who changes and controls the core identity of individuals.

The comic even visually hints at this role behavior when Terezi wears Jade’s Witch shoes:

Her Witch of Heart subrole should support her Seer of Mind role, not the other way around! Using the subrole, one’s inverse, as the lead role is not a healthy mode of operation! It spells disaster! This behavior foretells dire consequences.

There is something else foreboding about Vriska’s return. The characters all seem to intuitively KNOW these events are not supposed to happen. They KNOW things have been changed, that this is not how the story is supposed to go, that this is not the intended path of the Alpha Timeline. They have an almost meta-awareness of it.

JANE: But it wouldn't surprise me if the one who dealt my fatal blow was the leader of the raid [Vriska].

JANE: This was the unanticipated factor. JANE: Their leader was someone who was not expected to show up with them at all. […] JANE: You see, Callie, your historical documents make no mention of the leader of the raid, because originally, the curtains closed early on this plucky customer. JANE: But the hero was written back into our story by some inscrutable gambit of circumstance which we may never fully understand.

JOHN: i randomly appeared and knocked vriska out cold, just like the scarf told me to. […] TEREZI: YOU W3R3N'T SUPPOS3D TO DO TH1S! TEREZI: 1 W4S SUPPOS3D TO K1LL H3R! TEREZI: YOU JUST DOOM3D US 4LL!!!

Does Terezi’s reaction sound familiar? It should. Dave reacts the same way when John accidentally “zaps in,” interrupting his and Jade’s conversation and retconning events that originally occurred.

DAVE: you being here DAVE: thats not supposed to happen […] DAVE: its not supposed to go down like this i can feel it JOHN: i know! […] JADE: whatever dave and i were going to argue about JADE: i think the moment has passed JADE: the whole thing is kind of ruined to be honest

Dave has the same thoughts as Terezi: that John should not be there, these events are not supposed to happen, and John has doomed the timeline. John explains to each of them that this is not the case because it’s “not time travel,” yet Dave and Terezi remain skeptical and uneasy.

This meta-awareness and sense of a doomed timeline occurs elsewhere, too: when Aranea puts on the Ring of Life and invades the merged session.

MEENAH: you know all youre doing is making another doomed timeline where everyone dies right ARANEA: Of course I know that.

After the events of Game Over, Roxy and John sense the timeline is doomed, as well.

ROXY: this is starting to feel an awful lot like the end […] ROXY: maybe we should just ROXY: admit to ourselves this is probably what its like when you find yourself in a timeline where everything went wrong ROXY: and you know it means youre doomed

But here’s the thing. In each of those cases, the timeline isn’t "doomed" in the traditional sense, events undone because of time travel. In both cases, events are actually retconned by John, making the timeline not doomed, but void.

John voids the Game Over timeline by going back and retrieving the Ring of Life, preventing Aranea from obtaining it.

Regarding Dave and Jade’s confrontation, John purposefully retcons his retcon, setting events back to how they originally transpired, voiding his interference. He creates a semi-stable retcon loop.

In the new Alpha Timeline, because the characters have this same meta-awareness that these events are not supposed to happen—that Vriska is not supposed to be alive—and they sense that the timeline is doomed, I suspect John will retcon his retcon again, undoing the undoing of Vriska’s death, and creating another semi-stable retcon loop.

Why? Meta-narratively speaking, so events will play out how they originally were intended, how the characters KNOW and FEEL they are supposed to happen. So it won’t undo all the character growth the characters undergo. Besides,

It's also logical, since there is essentially nothing new in paradox space. Everything that can happen is either a visual or substantive reproduction of something which has already transpired on a timeline, offshoot or otherwise.

Another semi-stable retcon loop is bound to occur at some point. We were shown the first one for a reason.

Aside from all the parallels to events surrounding John's previous semi-stable retcon loop, more evidence supports a retcon of this new Alpha Timeline.

Caliborn points out the irony that Vriska “ACTUALLY THOUGHT SHE WAS GOING TO BE RELEVANT” and tells her to “KEEP DREAMING,” which is visualized by a “PSYCHE-OUT!!!” watermark and Vriska losing her head.

In the current iteration of the Alpha Timeline, Vriska’s new life state gives her the opportunity to have greater relevance and importance than before, when she was dead. “Dreaming” can even be a euphemism for “dead,” as death in dream bubbles compares to the state of dreaming and never waking up.

Caliborn seems to know Vriska will not be as important as she thinks she will be, and by telling her to “KEEP DREAMING,” he’s effectively telling her to stay dead. If John retcons his retcon, and Vriska actually remains dead after all, not only will this fulfill Caliborn’s statement, but it would prove to be the ultimate “PSYCHE-OUT!!!” to everyone, particularly to us readers.

Doc Scratch provides another indication John will retcon his retcon. Doc Scratch claims to have “absolute mastery of the Alpha Timeline” alone, any deviations withering from his perception. If the Alpha Timeline remains on its present course, it would make Doc Scratch either a liar or incorrect about this mastery.

When John retcons Vriska’s death, it voids events of the original Alpha Timeline, events Doc Scratch explicitly shows us.

    John's retcon turns the original Alpha Timeline, the events Doc Scratch shows us, into a void timeline. If Doc Scratch’s knowledge only pertains to this pre-retcon Alpha Timeline, his mastery is not of the true Alpha, but a voided version of it.

Doc Scratch is omniscient and does not lie. Yet at the same time, he has difficulty with Void.

AG: Sure you know a lot, 8ut I know for a FACT there's stuff you don't know. That's true. But the gaps in my knowledge exist by design. They are the pillars of shadow on which my comprehensive vision is built. Necessary pockets of void meant to effectuate outcomes I've foreseen and which will require my influence. Each dark pocket, in time, will be filled.

Occasionally I discover there are things I have not always known. It gives me the opportunity to make deductions, which are practically always flawless. […] But sometimes that is the nature of these hollows in my perception. It feels a bit like dark water, sloshing about the cavity in my head.

Wouldn’t it make sense for the new, current Alpha Timeline to be eventually retconned back to how events originally transpired? It would make the present Alpha, wherein Vriska lives, a void timeline. Void, which can escape Doc Scratch’s perception.

Considering Vriska “occupied a blind spot” to the Condesce, Jane, and Jade with her return, it seems reasonable she could occupy one of Doc Scratch’s “dark pockets,” as well.

If John retcons his retcon and creates a semi-stable retcon loop, it would validate Doc Scratch's mastery of the final, true Alpha Timeline, and it would reinforce the notion of pockets of Void in his knowledge.

But all of this raises another question: If eventually John is going to retcon the new, current Alpha Timeline back to its original state, what importance does the present timeline have?

The answer is Calliope’s alternate reality self.

JADE: like i said, [Alt!Calliope] just finished telling me that she was able to beat her brother in this reality JADE: but apparently, that wasnt supposed to happen? JADE: so she lived out the rest of her life in a doomed timeline and eventually died

Now, granted, this Calliope could be any Calliope from any regular doomed timeline, but I don’t think this is the case. This Calliope seems too important and special to be a random doomed one. This Calliope indicates her story is tied somehow to our John, the same John with retcon abilities and unstuck in canon.

JADE: and then she did this kinda fancy transition [...] to a story about MY brother... who was stuck in a doomed timeline too […] JADE: almost all our friends had died JADE: and johns only hope was to return to his planet, and attempt to complete his personal quest

Jade’s wording about Calliope is suspiciously similar to descriptions of timelines John retcons: Her defeat over Caliborn isn’t “supposed to happen.” If this Calliope is one who retroactively embodies Paradox Space, it would make sense for her to have been a part of the Alpha Timeline at one point, even if that timeline is eventually retconned. A standard doomed Calliope likely would not have enough importance to have such drastic influence over all of reality itself.

The difference between this Calliope and all other doomed Calliopes, why she unprecedentedly dominated her brother, could be in how they were raised: without Gamzee’s influence. In the present Alpha Timeline, Gamzee is suspiciously absent at the end of the three-year journey.

  The meaning of Terezi’s ominous message, “you don’t need him,” has not yet been explained. Perhaps it refers to Gamzee. If removed from the picture, he cannot raise the cherubs, influencing their upbringing, personalities, resources, and knowledge.

    Remember, just as Calliope is “not supposed to” dominate, Gamzee is “not supposed to” die. Hussie even states he is “not aware of a single timeline in which [Gamzee] dies.” If Gamzee only ever dies in a void timeline, each time the Alpha retconned so his death never occurs, Hussie’s supposed lack of its awareness makes sense.

If John retcons his retcon, it will make the current Alpha Timeline, wherein Vriska lives, a void timeline in actuality. It seems fitting that a Thief of Light from a void timeline would steal the Alpha Timeline’s Light—its importance and relevance. Not to mention her Page of Void subrole, empowering others to exploit Void—a void timeline—maximizing its use.

However, everything the heroes have done so far has advanced Lord English’s machinations. What exactly will happen is unclear, but all the ominous foreshadowing surrounding Vriska's return hints that something disastrous will occur and force John to go back and retcon this timeline.

One clue is Jane’s phrasing of Vriska’s return and the raid she leads in the merged session:

JANE: The tilt between the friendly and felonious was a true horse race again. A real barn burner in the brewing.

Jane’s colorful wording metaphorically surrounds them with horses.

VRISKA: I think I've just decided that 8eing surrounded 8y horses might 8e the ultim8 8ad omen. Nothing good can ever follow or precede those circumstances.

The Ultimate Bad Omen. Vriska’s return is ominous indeed.

Here we have a nice picture of the Green Sun in the black void of the Furthest Ring:

But if we take the image and invert it...

...We have a Pink Sun in a white void.

If the Green Sun and black void symbolize the current instance of Paradox Space, perhaps the Pink Sun and white void symbolize a new instance of Paradox Space, a new reality to where the heroes will escape.

Classpect Profile

When people try to determine a mythological role (or "classpect"), they often tend to focus on only one class and one aspect that fit an individual. Possibly two if they subscribe to the inversion/subrole/duality theory. That is, they focus only on the Hero Title and possibly its inverse.

But really, if the 12 aspects are meant to encompass all of reality, and the classes are how one interacts with an aspect, wouldn’t that mean every aspect has influence on an individual, not just one or two of them? That would mean an individual consists of every aspect and class.

I theorize that there are 12 different roles (or classpects) that fit a person—6 unique pairs of roles—comprised of each standard classes and each aspect.

I call these 6 pairs a Classpect Profile. The primary pair is the Hero Title and subrole.

Example profile:

Significance of a Classpect Profile

Essentially, a Classpect Profile helps you gain a better understanding of yourself and how you might affect reality, beyond one or two aspects.

If you’re having difficulty determining your precise Hero Title (and subrole), solving your Classpect Profile can help you discover it, through process of elimination.

A Classpect Profile also provides Hero Title options! For whatever reason, you’re not fond of your primary role, you can choose an alternate role as your Hero Title. Not a fan of the Bard codpiece? Or maybe you have a “gender-exclusive” class opposite of your gender, and you’d prefer one that matches. Maybe your session needs a Space or Time player. Maybe your session has players with overlapping classes or aspects, and you want everyone’s to be unique. Whatever the reason, now you have alternate possibilities!

Determining which roles comprise a Classpect Profile

First, it requires a full understanding of what each class and aspect means. It also requires a lot of introspection, self-reflection, and self-understanding. There are many useful tools and resources to aid you in the process.

In my next post, I’ll guide you through a step-by-step process to solve your Classpect Profile.

I’ve been mulling over the Prospit/Derse dreamer distinction and I think it primarily boils down to this:

Prospit dreamers instinctively embrace their calling and their role.

Derse dreamers instinctively resist their calling and role.

What exactly that means and how it manifests itself varies from person to person. (And Space and Time players might be an exception, possibly defaulting to Prospit and Derse, respectively.)

But the distinction makes sense thematically, considering how Prospit and Derse seem to operate.