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Dustin's Vecna taunting , Edward/ Eddie and the Billy-Eddie / Max-Dustin parallels

So, we all know that Dustin is devastated from Eddie's death right. I'm starting to think more and more that his (imho inevitable) attack from Vecna because of this will tie into the Eddie corpse puppet thing. But let's not get too ahead of ourselves. Dustin's danger coding has been in the works for a while, and very much in season 4. His first scene is very familiar because of its similarities to Chrissy's tormenting and Mike being late consistently (also once again connecting Vecna to mothers but anywho) . And not only that, but he gets some very interesting Max (and Will) parallels that are never a good thing if your goal is to not be Vecnattacked yk

Then we get this interesting bit of dialogue over here ; Dustin wearing a similar colour to Max while talk of him being cursed goes on...It's not a good look. Nor is he being 'fine' when Max says this as well.

I think this specific parallel speaks a lot for the situation. Lucas uses the exact same phrasing that Brenner does, and Brenner (as well as El) talk about friends (plural). Not only that, but the only other person facing the camera when Owens' voiceover talks about 'her friends being in the eye of the storm' is Dustin!! Max already had her lot, so it's Dustin's turn now.

In fact, Dustin has some of the most intense Vecna vision foreshadowing in season 3. He is the first character we see have something completely weird happen to him, and him rationalising it as it being a dream (vs all the vecna vision language revolving around dreams, nightmares, etc) AND a direct Join us foreshadowing from 2 of the most 'rainbow room henward' coded characters in the show (but this is the topic of another post)

Ok this one is for me but just a few tiny bits and pieces of Dustin Brehenward coding that i kept stumbling upon which i will definitely investigate further because the plethora of Brenner - Dustin parallels are fascinating to me and very important for the imminent Edward narrative (as are his shirts, because both Drama Club and the Explorer hoodie got me like hmmmmok)

Ok now that I've presented my Dustin Bones coding, some more speculatory stuff about how I think this would manifest under the cut.

So what I believe is going to happen is a reenactment of Max's Billy-in-the-mindscape scene but instead of it being in the mindspace, it would be in an actual physical setting, which could very well be the upside down. However, since we have some pictures of Dustin in the cemetery :

I could definitely see them having an actual direct parallel and have Dustin be in the cememetery as well (in a vision or not, doesn't really matter).

Dustin had a far less complicated relationship with Eddie than Max with Billy, and we know that he can't move on, he's dressing like Eddie, clings on to hellfire, and probably feels immense guilt over leaving Eddie's body behind. It's definitely an open wound that Vecna can take advantage of and something that can provide a pathway to a lot of Edward stuff.

I am partial to Dustin seeing corpse-Eddie in the flesh for the horror part but also for the exposition about the name Edward; from Dustin's side, it could provide a great arc to give him emotional depth and explore his character more.

I believe that Dustin will attempt to go back to the UD for something new-plot related and end up getting a Nancy/Max-vision-mix/reality. It's not that Vecna needs to open more gates, but it's never been about only the gates, he thrives off of people's trauma and weakening the party as they're finally bonding together is definitely a good tactic.

In my heart of hearts I want Dustin to call Vecna-Possessing-Eddie's-Body 'Eddie' at first because it looks like actual Eddie and Vecnward to say something about that being his name/ rejecting being called Henry or something oh I'd eat that upppp lmao. Anyway Dustin babe be safe over there!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!

Owens, Cancer, Peter, Regenerative Healing and The Cure

So, the mysterious Peter Owens has been haunting me lately. And now, I have a theory about him.

I think that Peter Owens was Owens’ son who may have had cancer, and that Owens’ involvement with HNL and Henward’s kidnapping/testing on Henward in the lab was likely connected to Owens trying to save Peter and find a cure for cancer.

Let’s get into it.

So. Why would Peter Owens have cancer and what evidence is there to support the idea of Peter having cancer?

Well, as far as how Peter Owens got cancer goes, Hopper talks about Agent Orange causing cancer in the children of Vietnam war veterans such as himself, which is what happened to Sara.

Hopper even namedrops “Uncle Sam” during that scene, versus Sam being named Sam Owens:

So, there’s a chance that Peter’s cancer was the result of Owens being involved in the Vietnam war, or Owens simply being exposed to some other chemical, or even just a genetic predisposition to cancer passed down to Peter (something we’ll come back to later in this post when I talk about Fringe.)

And regarding the other evidence to support Peter having cancer, Owens has So Much disease and cure and cancer imagery surrounding him, right down to talking about “stopping the spread” re: the gate and talking about replication all the time.

Owens’ connection to the supernatural is almost aways tied to references of “spreading” and “disease,” and he’s specifically focused on stopping things from spreading- much like cancer:

And he also talks about a "cure" in the context of a virus/disease spreading:

And Owens also has this scene where the other scientist is talking about pesticides vs Hopper talking about how Agent Orange was touted as a herbicide- which connects Owens to that Hopper cancer scene yet again:

Owens also refers to possessed Will as “son”- possessed Will, who currently has a “disease” replicating in his body and taking him over and killing him:

And that shot of Hopper in the stairwell after Sara died from cancer versus the shot of Owens in the stairwell and the two being paralleled- which makes sense of Owens, like Hopper, also lost a child to cancer:

And I also talked in this post about how Owens “gets”/understands what it’s like to lose a son. And Owens also talks AGAIN about “getting it,” and this time it’s SPECIFICALLY in the context of Will having a “disease” replicating in his body and killing him:

And the next scene RIGHT after that scene where Owens talks about “getting” what it’s like to have a son replicating with something inside of him, we get this shot of Nancy’s tape and SPECIFICALLY we get the line from Owens about stopping the spread AGAIN:

And to top all of this off, OWENS is the character who drops the word “cancer” and who compares the spread of the UD to cancer:

Owens’ son having died of cancer would also explain why he’s not willing to let Will die from the “virus”/shadow particles:

Especially with that “say that to me again” line from Owens- that’s not a rational, “here’s the scientific reason why I disagree with you,” or even “hey, killing kids is morally wrong,” instead, it’s an immediate emotional response that lacks context as he’s not even just like. being emotional and saying “hey killing kids is bad,” instead, he just gets emotional and makes a threat but doesn’t provide any specific reason for it.

That scene has always felt a bit off to me, like there’s something we’re missing, like we’re missing some reason why the other scientist should know not to say something like that to Owens Specifically. Especially since the scientists all shut up for a bit after Owens says that/there’s clearly some weight to his words/something that the audience isn’t aware of.

Which, that would make sense if those other scientists knew about what happened to Peter/him dying of cancer. After all, it would be an obvious dick move to suggest letting a young boy die of a spreading disease to a dude whose son died of cancer.

Long story short, the spread/cancer imagery is CONSTANT with Owens, and so are the references to him losing a son.

Now that we’ve established that the basis/subtext is there for Owens to have a son that died of cancer, that brings up the question of why would Henward be necessary for Owens to try and cure cancer?

Well, James and I were chatting awhile back about Henriette Lacks, after I’d mentioned that I thought there was a connection between the cancer references in ST vs Vecna’s regenerative healing, as Vecna’s regen healing seems to work a lot like cancer cells/might be what caused his strange appearance, as a lot of his skin seems to resemble tumors, with him even having what looks like random TEETH on his skin, which is something often seen in tumors.

And when we look at Henrietta Lacks, her cells, which were taken from a cervical cancer biopsy, were the first immortal human cell line that reproduced infinitely. Henrietta’s cells were used to study cancer treatments and how to stop the spread of cancer without having to test on an entire living person, and instead just being able to test on the cells themselves, as usually, human cells die pretty quickly after being separated from the person, but Henrietta’s cells did not, and instead, kept dividing. ST regen healing seems to act basically like cancer cells but with an even faster rate of growth/replication, which is exactly what Henrietta’s cells were.

So, if Henward had regen healing, and if Henward’s cells both a.) replicated like cancer cells and b.) replicated even faster the way that Henrietta’s cells did/were basically immortal even when removed from the body, then Henward would have been the perfect subject to use to research a cure for cancer.

This may also tie into Brenner’s claim that he was trying to help/cure Henward/Henward talking about how his parents wanted to cure him- if Henward’s regen healing was similar to Henrietta Lacks’ cells, it’s worth noting that the properties of Henrietta Lacks’ cancer cells were the result of being infected with HPV. So, if Henward also had some sort of disease that caused the same sort of thing & made him a sickly child & if Brenner/Owens claimed that they could cure him the same way they planned on curing cancer but needed his cells to do so/to test the cure on/ro develop the cure. Especially since Henrietta’s own cancer cells are what killed her- so there’s a chance that Henward was at risk of the same sort of thing happening/that he didn’t quite have proper regen healing before the lab but DID have those cells (and then lab experiments/gettinf yeeted to the yellow UD kickstarted in the actual regen healing we see with Vecna).

Plus, yknow. The name Henry vs Henrietta… and the fact that Henrietta Lacks’ cells were taken without her consent vs Henward being kidnapped and taken to the lab, clearly without his consent.

So, again, somebody with regen healing is basically a prime candidate for being used to try and cure cancer.

But that same person could also be a path to near immortality. Because after all, like I said, regen healing cells act like cancer cells, and cancer cells ignore the signals that tell them to self destruct/they’re basically immortal, and Henrietta Lacks’ cells even moreso, as they replicate even faster and again, ignore those destruction signals. So, they’d basically be the key to immortality if there was such a key. If an entire person could do what a single cancer/Henrietta Lacks cell did (which is likely exactly what Henward’s regen healing does, or something similar), with some tweaking, there’s a chance they could become immortal/regenerate when injured the way Vecna does etc.

If Brenner ended up using this research to give himself regenerative healing/pursuing immortality for himself, it would explain how he survived the Demogorgon attack in S1, and it would explain why Matthew Modine is convinced that Brenner STILL isn’t dead. It would also give Brenner a motive for his experiments that goes beyond mere scientific curiosity, which would explain why he was willing to go to such extreme lengths for his research.

And if Brenner wanted to experiment on Henward’s cells for the purpose of his own immortality versus Owens wanting to do it to try and find a cure for cancer, it would explain how the two of them could have such opposing morals but end up working together, because even if their goals were totally different (immortality vs cancer cure), they both needed to take the same path/experiment on Henward.

After all, whether you like/trust Owens or not, based on what we see from him in the show, he DOES seem to have moral lines that Brenner does not.

For example, during NINA, he talks about how he’s compromised his principles/morals by helping with NINA & how he sees a traumatized little girl, something he’s clearly distressed by, unlike Martin. He also says that he’s only doing this because Martin said that it was the only way:

So, how does a guy like that, who clearly has some sort of moral code/who does genuinely seem to care about peoole like El and Will in a way that Brenner does not end up working for HNL/working with Brenner/experimenting on Henward?

Well, if it was Owen’s son’s life on the line… it would make sense for that to be the one thing that could get Owens to compromise his morals and experiment on Henward- after all, in that screenshot from earlier, Owens lists his family and his principles together- two things that seem to be equally important to him. So, if one of those things (his family/his son) was in danger, would he be willing to compromise the other thing (his morals/principles) to save his family? I think he would.

And to top all of this off, it would also track perfectly with the Fringe parallels (with Fringe being a huge source of inspiration for ST/constant direct parallels).

**FRINGE SPOILERS**

In Fringe, scientist Walter Bishop’s son, Peter, is dying of a rare genetic disease. Walter is trying desperately to find the cure, but fails, and his Peter dies. However, Walter has been using a window into another timeline to watch his alternate timeline self (nicknamed Walternate) *also* work on a cure for Peter- and the alternate Peter isn’t cured yet, but is still alive when Walter’s Peter dies. And one day, when watching Walternate work on a cure, Walter notices that Walternate found the cure, but Walternate was distracted and thought that his cure/experiment had failed. So, Walter went into the other timeline and planned simply on curing alternate timeline Peter, but ended up taking him/kidnapping him back to Walter’s own timeline, and keeping him there and raising him as if he was his actual Peter.

And Owens is EXTREMELY paralleled to Walter. Like. Constantly. Costuming parallels, dialogue parallels, entire scene/shot parallels. It’s literally neverending and constant. Go watch even 5 minutes of like any Fringe scene with Walter, and you’ll notice it. Both Victor and Owens are deeply Walter paralleled to the point of almost verging on plagiarism LMAO.

So, this would track with Owens kidnapping a child (Henward) to try and save his son/trying to cure his son’s genetic disease, just like Walter did (except the child Walter kidnapped was Peter himself, although Walter did also do experiments on other children, such as Olivia), and possibly even crossing timelines to do so, which has me staring at all of the Henry vs Edward weirdness…

This is also likely why Owens’ son is named Peter- it’s meant to be a reference to Peter Bishop (which, it’s also interesting that Peter and Walter have the last name “Bishop,” as there’s the Bishop chess piece & the idea of their last name being connected to chess is referenced in Fringe, which has me staring at Henward talking about how Brenner moves people around like pieces on a chessboard to manipulate them- which would make sense if Brenner was manipulating Owens and his son & leading Owens to believe that they were pursuing a cure for cancer when in reality Brenner was pursuing his own immortality/regeneration).

So, yeah! I won’t be surprised at all if S5 reveals that Owens’ son, Peter, died from cancer.

And what El says about Brenner not letting Henry go- if Peter died, it would make sense to let Henry go/for Owens to want to let Henry go, because he doesn’t need Henry anymore because he can’t save Peter anymore.

But if Brenner wanted to continue his research/continue pursuing his own immortality, it would make sense for him to not let Henry go, and would explain why it’s Brenner Specifically who is listed as not letting Henry go.

This would also explain why Owens doesn’t seem to be present in the lab during any of El’s flashbacks, not even back in 1979/any of the NINA memories- if he stopped working on the project after Peter’s death…

It would also explain why Hopper introduces El to Owens as if they’ve never met- because El hasn’t met him:

Especially since Sullivan refers to El as “Brenner’s little pet,” and doesn’t include Owens in that regard, and Owens’ bitchy line about daddy-daughter time/Owens not approving of what Brenner did to El/his relationship with her:

However, there’s also the matter of the Peter that Brenner asks for over the intercom:

And I think there’s a few options here in the context of this post:

1.) The Peter that Brenner asks for is simply another random Peter, not Peter Owens, but is delivering subtext about Peter Owens (ie, lab Peter died, delivering the subtext that Peter Owens also died, just in a different way).

This could also be a reference to the timeline weirdness that we see with the massacre, as Peter in Fringe is basically the cause of the two timelines colliding/opening a hole between the two of them.

2.) The Peter that Brenner asks for IS Peter Owens, working as an orderly in the lab. He may have died during the 1979 massacre, and so, then while that doesn’t explain why we didn’t see Owens at all in the flashbacks pre-1979 massacre, if Peter died then, it would explain why Owens is absent from HNL in El’s post-1979 HNL memories. And also, it may actually still explain why Owens was absent during the 1979/pre massacre NINA flashbacks- if Peter’s cancer HAD been cured/treated and he was simply working there or a patient receiving treatment there or BOTH, then Owens wouldn’t necessarily need to work at the lab anymore, as his goal (saving Peter) had been accomplished, and then Peter died during the 1979 massacre.

3.) Henry or Edward was brainwashed into believing that he was Peter Owens/Owens’ son in an attempt to get him to cooperate.

Especially with what I’ve talked about before re: The Changeling and other things and the idea of Edward believing that he IS Henry. If Henry wasn’t useful for whatever reason and they needed Edward instead, and needed Edward to believe that he’s Henry, it would be helpful if the actual Henry believes that he isn’t Henry and is, in fact, Peter.

This would also explain why Henward’s fake name for casting was “Peter Ballard”.

And while option 3.) does admittedly sound far-fetched, when we look at Fringe, Olivia (who is very similar to Henward/blonde child who got experimented on against her will) is swapped with her alternate timeline counterpart/has her alternate timeline counterpart’s memories implanted into her head (staring at NINA & those bts pics that show that Young Henward has a NINA suit in his costume wardrobe and also staring at the multiple versions of the Creel murders that we see/Vecna’s memories of the murders being different from Victor’s retelling), because one Olivia has powers that the other Olivia does not have, and in order to get the Olivia with powers to cooperate willingly/use her powers, they have to convince her that she truly is the other Olivia.

Which, that would also track with that line about 001 struggling with his powers at first until suddenly he came in one day and everything changed- especially since that dialogue is in the context of memories, specifically, sad/angry memories- so, if Edward had some of Henry’s memories of the Creel murders implanted into him and believed that they were his own memories/believed that he was Henry… and then Henry possibly being led to believe that he was Peter in some way/Henry even simply becoming a proxy for Peter in the sense of them experimenting on Henry instead of Peter (to test cures in case something goes wrong so that they don’t risk Peter’s life) even if he doesn’t truly believe that he’s Peter. Which, that means that they would have to give Henry cancer- or, mess with his regen healing to have the same effect, OR infect him with shadow particles which have been very cancer-paralleled, as we’ve seen with Will in S2.

Anyway! Much to think about. Admittedly that last bit is a fair bit of fun speculation, but overall, I really do think there’s some solid connections here regarding Owens, Peter, Henward, Fringe, and cancer. Also, I won’t be surprised if we get a father-son vibe between Henward and Owens in the lab, which may explain part of why Owens has so many constant Victor parallels, with Victor being Henward’s actual father vs Owens possibly being a father figure, especially if Henward was ever brainwashed to believe that he was Peter.

TL;DR: HNL was studying how to give human subjects electromagnetic, most specifically visible light based, powers in order to bend space-time for their needs.

I’m going to try and condense this as much as I can because considering electromagnetism as a major force in ST (pun intended) opens up so many potential areas of analysis that can only be a brief cover of without turning into multiple essays.

Let’s go over the electromagnetic spectrum:

I hope you might already be recognizing some symbols we see often in Stranger Things, especially if you’ve been following the BTS and some location and set leaks from Season 5.

The electromagnetic spectrum encompasses the different frequencies of electromagnetic radiation - waves of energy that travel at the speed of light (and produce visible light to us at certain frequencies). You’ve probably heard of most of these, including cancer-causing gamma rays and x-rays, the visible light spectrum (the rainbow), microwaves, and radio waves.

In S5, we have the radio station as a main location for the characters. They’re also driving around in the radio station’s van, which has an image of a hawk emitting a rainbow (visible light radiation). Steve’s car also has a massive antenna on top of it. My first thoughts were that the team was trying to keep in contact with Max in hopes of her being able to hear them in her coma, considering she has a radio near her bedside. While that still may be a reason, I think the characters may have come to realize how important electromagnetic fields could be in their fight against Vecna (this where leader of the AV Club also focused on electromagnetic objects Scott Clarke may make his triumphant return).

Now to pivot onto why electromagnetism is so important to the lore of ST:

What the scientists in Hawkins Lab are likely studying is a way for human brains to produce or manipulate certain types of electromagnetic waves through telepathy. Most obviously this is seen by them having the kids try to manipulate and turn on a circle of light bulbs. Our brains actually already produce electromagnetic waves, but at a very slow frequency. The scientists are constantly measuring brain waves while conducting these experiments. We even get full shots of El’s brain waves during NINA, for example. We also see similar shots in S2 while Will is in the HNL.

You can also observe that the Hawkins National Laboratory has absolutely massive satellite dishes on it’s rooftop; ones that do not exist on the real life building but are added in post because they pose some sort of significance. Nudge, it’s because they are transmitting and receiving massive amounts of electromagnetic waves.

Why are they studying electromagnetic waves then?

They are studying electromagnetic waves because they are a method in which time travel can theoretically be achieved - the focus of the Montauk Project in which Stranger Things is based on. The military likely is investigating time travel as another war tactic against Russia.

Let us take a look at the first chapter of the Montauk Project: Experiments in Time book (they are seriously plagiarizing the living hell out of this thing):

Also, did you catch the whole 'attaching a massive antenna on the hood of my car to pick up a secret signal' thing? That's suspiciously similar to the state of Steve's car! Anyway...

The story of Stranger Things starts chronologically, as does Montauk, with the disappearance of the USS Eldridge and Project Rainbow (named after the bending of the visible light spectrum). Brenner’s father was revealed to have captained the boat in TFS, which disappeared for 12 hours into Dimension X and when it came back, the crew was killed or driven mad (except for Brenner Sr). This inspires Brenner to continue onto the Nevada project, and eventually, Hawkins National Lab’s studies. The USS Eldridge / Philadelphia Project conspiracy from real life went as follows:

They were studying electromagnetism, specifically the bending of light, to make objects invisible. This was only the first step in the experiments. Once Henry got involved and came back from his trip to Dimension X with powers, Brenner must have realized he could potentially use human subjects to manipulate electromagnetic fields themselves. Human subjects didn’t require machinery or set up and could bend space-time wherever they pleased, as long as they were able to learn the ability.

The more conspiratiorial side of Theoretical Physics proposes using circulating light beams to warp time-space, creating a wormhole in which one can literally walk through time. This is pop-science, likely not true but interesting for fiction purposes. This method of time travel being used is heavily implied due to the fact that the USS Eldridge was already able to disappear into another dimension by the bending of light.

This is how it worked in the Montauk Project book (absolutely ridiculous how much they took from this honestly):

My guess is that in the Stranger Things universe, they have not yet managed to time travel, only to create portals into this alien Dimension X. Previously, said portals were only made twice by highly advanced technological equipment. El demonstrated that she was able to open a portal all by herself - another step to achieving time travel with singular human subjects. Season five is when we will see the beginning of the time travel plot line, though it like in Montauk is likely already in a loop.

That’s where we get the name for the Rainbow Room, named after this Project Rainbow. The rainbow represents the full spectrum of visible light, and the goals of the project to bend said light into portals and eventually time travel wormholes.

Implications?:

-Well, first of all it seems very obvious by this point that we are going for a time travel plot line, and this is how it will be achieved.

-Will is heavily connected to light in general, the sun, and of course… the rainbow. He is also implied be the one involved in the time travel plot line. This will be very relevant going forward and deserves it’s own post. Potential funniness of defeating Vecna with the power of the rainbow afoot.

-Coma patients are known to have odd, barely detectable brain waves. The kids will be able to communicate with Max in her coma using the electromagnetic spectrum somehow, probably through the radio waves.

-On the farthest end of the spectrum, we have ionizing gamma ray radiation, which is known to cause cancer in humans. Expect Hopper’s daughter Sara to connect to this plot line (and perhaps Sam Owens’ dead son). There is a whole theory on this site already called radiationgate. I have not managed to look into it yet but I think they are probably onto something there. The original al pitch mentions the UD leakage into the real world causing cancer as well.

Lucas says he knows where Eddie (Edward) is and they transition right to El in the police car. Then Lucas leads them to Hopper's cabin where they focus on Eggos and Jason searches El's room for Eddie. Owens says El is one of the good ones (001s)... oh El Hopper you are so Edward Creel reincarnated.

Edward Creel is El, Henry Creel is Will. No seriously.

I was reading the Montauk book and well... I have evidence that Eleven is a "reincarnation" of Edward Creel. And Will could be a reincarnation of Henry.

In "The Montauk Project: Experiments in Time," we hear about a man named Duncan Cameron. He has psychic abilities much like the lab kids and was clearly the inspiration for Henry. Duncan also has a brother named Edward Cameron. They both were working on the USS Eldridge and were later involved in time travel experiments.

At some point during their time travel shenanigans, Edward decided to stay in 1943 while Duncan stayed in 1983. This caused Duncan to start aging rapidly and in order to preserve his abilities, they figured out that they carry a unique electromagnetic signature. This signature is basically their entire personhood, their mind and memories. Both Duncan and Edward's signatures were transferred onto new people, reincarnating them. The children they transferred their minds to have no recollection of who they were before the "reincarnation" process.

And I think this happened to Will and El.

As other people have theorized, Edward Creel is Henry's brother who got lost in another timeline. I think that the lab found him and his mind was transferred into El, much like Edward Cameron's mind was transferred. In Montauk, Edward was replicated through age regression, but it doesn't have to be one-to-one.

Edward and Duncan got stuck in a side time tunnel at one point and encountered aliens. This could be where the timeline split for Henry and Edward too.

How do I know they'll use this part of the Montauk experiments? Well... they already did. Edward was renamed Al Bielek after his transfer. In the play and in Eddie's book, we find out that Eddie (Edward) Munson's dad is named Al Munson. There's no way it's a coincidence that they paired up an Edward and an Al together. It's a reference to this part of Montauk.

Ok so why do I think El has part of Edward Creel's mind? First off, El and Al's names sound very similar. Hm. Their backstories also connect. Al was taken in by a family who had a baby that died young. Two of El's parental figures had children who died young. Hopper's daughter died at the age of 6. Terry was told she "miscarried" in the third trimester. Al's parents were brainwashed after they stuck Edward into their family. Terry was also brainwashed.

In the Edward Creel version of the Creel murders, Edward was found without eyes and mutilated limbs. Could be lab interference, or they could be telling us that Edward is actually dead. In Montauk, they only wanted to transfer signatures when their star subject was dying. This could be why they transferred Edward Creel's signature into El. He was killed before his time.

Edward’s version of events happened on March 21st. This is the same night Chrissy was murdered in Eddie’s trailer. The bodies were found on the 22nd, just like Chrissy. El was accused of wanting to kill Angela after the assault that happened on the 22nd. Eddie was later killed by bats. Is this another hint that Edward Creel is dead? The vampire references surrounding Eddie might also link to Edward Creel becoming “undead” through El.

Side theory that kind of relates: Was Edward the boy Henry put in a wheelchair? This could explain why the Creels have the wheelchair in their attic. Maybe they left Edward behind to stay with other relatives for his safety. Or Edward is related, but not a sibling? A cousin?

Vecna slash Henry says that there was a time when he wanted El by his side. In Montauk, Edward and Duncan (aka Henry) went back in time together to save the USS Eldridge and complete the time loop. It could be that after the signature transfer, El and Will work together to fix the time loop, so Vecna is referencing future events where they do work together, but through a different time.

There isn't much information about Edward Cameron in the Montauk book, so that part of the evidence ends here.

If El had Henry's timeline brother transferred into her mind, this could explain why Henry felt so connected to her compared to the other lab children. In the play, it's evident that he felt connected to her upon her birth! He even says she reminds him of someone he knew and while he was talking about himself here, it could be another hint at El literally being someone he knew: his brother Edward.

This isn't to say El isn't her own person, she is, but she does have the mind and memories of Edward in her too. She's both!

Now onto the Will of it all. Will has Henry's electromagnetic signature. Like, this is confirmed. They literally say so.

Seriously.

As I said earlier, the signature transfer causes the original person to lose all sense of who they were before the transfer. This is basically what the Mind Flayer did to Will when he was possessed. The lines between Will and whatever was taking over his mind were being blurred, but they got him back. Not without consequences, though. The "signature" wasn't removed, Will still has Henry in him. He is both Will and Henry.

Will and Henry's backstories are nearly identical. Henry got lost in another dimension, got possessed, and now has powers, all things that happened to Will. And we know the iconic parallel of them both being described as sensitive. Their family dynamics are also similar. Virginia and Lonnie are abusive, Jonathan and Alice are older siblings to their brothers (not to mention their dead bunny parallel), Joyce and Victor have a few similarities too. Will and Henry even dress similarly in their plaid shirts.

Will is described to have personality changes in s2, but the most significant changes we see before his possession are just extensions of himself. He became more reserved, more quiet than he usually is. Henry also seemed to be quiet, so their personalities combining exacerbated Will's behavior.

I'm not the first to point this out, but Will draws a zombie that looks very similar to Henry when he enters Dimension X. When questioned, Will says that the drawing is him and doesn't expand on why (we know why, but still). Henry is zombie boy, zombie boy is Will, Will is Henry.

And that wasn't even scratching the surface of the Henry Will parallels.

It's also worth noting that the kid Duncan transferred his signature to was 12 years old. You know, the same age Will was when he got kidnapped. Duncan was in the year 1983 (before time traveling) when this happened.

This could be why Vecna slash Henry sought out Will in the first place. Like Duncan, Henry was dying, and needed a replacement to preserve himself. Will was the perfect subject. This connects back to my theory that Henry's physical body is already dead and the Vecna we see is his soul/mind.

It's possible that Henry's soul/body is now just a puppet for the Mind Flayer, abandoned of Henry's previous traits. When Henry tells his backstory, he has no recollection of the better aspects of his personality we are shown in the play, he only remembers the dark parts. This might be because the good parts of Henry aren't with him, but with Will.

Henry’s Creel murders happened on March 25th. It’s interesting how on March 25th, we see Will burying a body in the desert. Will is linked to death on the 25th? Same scene, Mike says “It’s the number. We’ve had it this whole time (looks at Will).” Will is the number… 001.

Duncan couldn't die due to time paradoxes, which is why they transferred his mind to a new body. Maybe this is why the Mind Flayer wants to keep Will alive. Will and Henry need to live as one (haha) to keep the timeline stable. This could provide time travel scenarios in s5 where Will has to go back in time and cause future events...

Something interesting that I haven't seen discussed before is how Will's comment about Vegas actually connects to Henry. Patty, the one person Henry ever really connected to, was on the search for her biological mother. Patty found out that her mom was working at a casino in Vegas, so she left Hawkins to meet her there. Will references Vegas casinos in the van! This could be a subconscious desire from Henry's side of Will to seek out Patty. Honestly I hope Wills little reference is alluding to Patty coming back in s5 too.

One more thing, Will's relation to Henry and/or Dimension X started before 1983. Will drew the rainbow spaceship in 1979, a reference to the USS Eldridge. I think the transfer happened when Will was attached to the vine in the UD, so there are likely time shenanigans here. Or... the lab implanted Henry's mind into Will in 1979 when his physical body died, but even that doesn't align with Will's birthday ship!

Edward Cameron's memories of his time on the USS Eldridge were wiped, but Duncan still recalls the experiment. El also seems to have no recollection of the rainbow ship, but Will does. Edward didn't regain these memories until the mid 1980s. Could El begin to recall these events in s5?

El and Will having Edward and Henry's respective signatures also explains their weird sibling connection in s1.

El recognized Will because she knew him in another body in another timeline. They were meant to be siblings because they already were. Through Henry and Edward's memories of each other, El feels drawn to Will like she's always known him, despite never meeting.

Will and El switch places with each other too many times in the series for me to even provide examples (here's one). They swap places, go through parallel yet contrasting scenarios, much like their henward counterparts. This seems to be hinting at them having a higher connection than siblings by chance.

Circling back to Montauk, this line could be referencing Will and El completing/ending the time loop together, like Henry and Edward were supposed to before Edward's early demise.

The time loop goes from 1943 when the ship disappeared, to 1983 when Will was kidnapped. I think Will is the key to time travel and this might be unlocked when he and El work together to reach it. Their powers can combine to save the world. Will and El's connection transcends time and will fix time.

It would be actually interesting + as u said bylers have already analysed the whole show (every season) to point out possibility of Byler being endgame, so it would something refreshing to see new theories about the show!

I'm trying to think about possible byler proofs, but I feel like everything has been said. We already analyzed the whole show, frame per frame to look for some juicy details... So to change up a little bit, I wondered if spreading my theories about Stranger Things 5's future events could be interesting. I have various theories: future deaths, Vecna's role, few characters' reappearance, few characters' powers developpement, ships who make up, ships who break up, etc. First because my theories are not like every others, I never saw them being like a top theory. And also because they are very well written and developed. So here is my question....

Okay, strange theory, but I feel like anything in the Upside Down, likes things that start with B… like first first, the Demogorgan killed Barb, then in Season two, it killed Bob, then the Min’s Flayer killed Billy… they are also relationships that start with B. Barb was Nancy’s BEST friend, Bon was Joyce’s BOYFRIEND, and Billy was Max’s BROTHER (I know not technically but just roll with it)… so Barb = Best Friend, Bob = Boyfriend, and Billy = Brother.

See a pattern? It may just be a coincidence but, I may be wrong…

im a Byler analyst BUT i don't really post my analyses cuz I'm lazy 😭😭 I used to post theories sometimes but that was forever ago + i prefer to read theories.

But i love a good over-analysis soooooo I repost a lot of theories/ analyses! ^^ + some other stuff

and note abt me: i speak english, korean, and some basic hs french.

Nancy's storyline is S3 was not about sexism/misogyny

Just to be clear, I'm not insulting Nancy anywhere in here calling her a kid/child I'm just trying to explain the story and the characters takes on everything to explain it. I'm sorry about rambling a bit at the end I may have repeated some things but I was trying to make sure I got everything. But please read everything because it may cover any questions you have.

The men that are making fun of her never make it about her being a woman, its always about her being a child/intern. They laugh at her suggestions because shes an intern who has only worked there for 4 weeks at the most and is trying to make suggestions about how to run the paper, when they spent over 20+ years working there [as Tom says] to get a spot in that room.

Nancy herself never even says or implies that its about her being a woman necessarily. In fact, theres points that contradict that the storyline is about sexism. Like this next subject.

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Nancy's conversation with her mother is what gives it away. If this was about sexism, this is the part where Nancy is with another woman and can speak freely about men/sexism. She doesn't talk about sexism/being a woman ext though. Doesn't even imply it. I always thought this scene was odd because its about her being a kid, not a woman. I thought what a weird way to address the sexism/misogyny topic.

This is the part in the story where Nancy or her mother should be giving a speech about being a woman and how they're just as good as men and overcoming sexism, but that isn't the message being put out. Its all about Nancy being a kid. The advice Karen gives her and helps Nancy overcome her issue is also not about being a woman or fighting misogyny. Its about Nancy being a kid.

"I wanted to be right so badly." "And were you?" "I thought so. But maybe I just…don't want to admit that I'm wrong, because if I'm wrong, then…" "You're what everyone thinks you are." "Just a kid who has no idea what she's doing."

You're what everyone says you are /just a kid who has no idea whats she doing [Confirming the bosses at Hawkins post were making fun of her for that, it had nothing to do with sexism/her being a woman.

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Their insults towards her are never about her being a female, its always about her being a child/an intern. They call her Nancy Drew who is a "TEEN" detective. Nancy Drew often runs into trouble because she doesn't fully know whats doing. Shes very smart, but inexperienced. Again they are commenting about her inexperience. Not about her being a woman.

Bruce says about her forgetting mustard on his sandwich after she makes a suggestion for what to put in the paper. This isn't him being sexist, he is saying about how she can't even manage being an intern and getting that right, so why should they take her suggestions about how to run the paper seriously when shes only worked there for 4 weeks and can't even handle the menial tasks.

We never actually see the men being sexist apart from Bruce. Bruce makes a comment about a womans bust that is clearly sexist, but Bruce is never sexist towards her, nor are the other men. Their issues with her are always about her being a kid/an intern.

Tom clearly wasn't showing favoritism towards the men because he fired both of them even though Jonathan didn't 'cause as much trouble' as Nancy. Nancy did more, but Jonathan was given the same punishment as her.

Nancy was an intern and she was mad that she had to do interns job like get coffee. Men and women interns have to do this. It's not sexism. Interns jobs are to do menial tasks to help the higher ups [like get coffee ext] and learn as they go so they can advance to a higher level within the company.

The only reason Jonathan's job was different is because he had a skill no one else had there. Photography at a newspaper is also a menial task in itself. He was doing a menial task already, it was just different than Nancy's task because he had that skill, she didn't.

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"Can you have one of the other girls get the coffee today." "They're needed at their desks." It is Nancy who makes the suggestion for another girl to do it [not Tom] even though she is the intern working there. Even Tom protests this. Hes not being sexist and is not the one who made the suggestion for another female to do it in the first place. If anything Nancy was being sexist saying have one of the other girls do it. It's not that women get the coffee, its that interns get the coffee and she may have been the only female intern working there. They're a small paper I don't see them having a lot of interns at one time, but if there was maybe shes saying have one of the other interns get it and the other two interns are women. She just refers to them as 'the girls'. I can't see Nancy saying something sexist like that making the suggestion for another woman to get it. I think she is talking specifically about the few interns who work there.

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The "They like you no matter what you do." The bosses like Jonathan [not because hes a man] but because Jonathan comes in, keeps his head low, and does what hes told. Nancy is the opposite she is constantly making suggestions to the bosses how they should be running the paper.

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Even Nancy herself never says its about sexism or implies it. She never says about how she is being treated differently because shes a woman except that one time already covered above. If this was about sexism or her being a woman she would have addressed that, but she never does. In fact, she makes it about her being a child, not a woman as shown above. The bosses also might value Jonathan because he has a skill while Nancy doesn't.

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It's not sexism to expect an intern to do an interns job. Rachel on Friends has to do menial tasks like this as well when shes starting out in fashion. Her bosses weren't sexist, they give you menial tasks like that because you just started the job. You have to work your way to the top starting at the very bottom. This isn't a sexist thing. Its a people thing. Men have to do it too. Everyone, men included need to start out at the bottom and work their way to the top and gain skill and knowledge about the work before they can become a higher up. You can't just rush into the 'managers' office like Nancy did and start making suggestions about how to run the company when you only worked there for 3 weeks.

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Maybe Nancy *thought* that the men were being sexist when they weren't, but even that doesn't add up. Because of what I went over above. Nancy never makes it about her being a woman at all. She understands its about her being a kid and that shes inexperienced and has no skills like Jonathan to give her a leg up. Shes smart, but she doesn't have any particular skills that set her apart from the rest.

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The men never say anything towards her that is about her being a woman/they never say anything sexist. The only reason they're laughing at her suggestions and making fun of her is because shes a child and making suggestions to them the bosses when she just started working there. If Nancy was a man she would have been treated the exact same way. I'll make an example if I were a man and I started working at Walmart as a cashier and only worked there for 3 weeks and I went into a meeting that was meant for the managers and I started making suggestions about how to run the company when I knew nothing about it, they would laugh at me too. It had nothing to do with sexism.

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Im not sure where the fans got this maybe reading too much into certain lines, but Nancy herself doesn't even feel that she was being made fun of for being a woman. She says its about being a kid not a woman.