Diomedes - Tumblr Posts
questions the iliad is meant to inspire:
how free are we really, as human beings, to make our own decisions?
where should the line be drawn between heroism and cruelty?
ought the quest for individual honor to be prioritized over the lives of others?
questions i have:
what accounts for the bro code dissonance of agamemnon stealing achilles’s girl when he’s literally leading an army in a war that was started because paris stole his brother’s girl?
is diomedes single?
to the nearest thousand, how many heart emojis would achilles text to patroclus in an average day if the technology were available?
Guess who's missing his wife
no, no you don't GET IT. okay - so he's only a little kid when his dad goes off to war and dies, right? he doesn't know his dad. all he knows is that his dad was a great warrior favored by athena, and that he has to avenge him (IMAGINE a little kid sitting by his mother's feet while she spins wool telling him he has to avenge his father some day, imagine it). so he grows up a little, following in his father's footsteps to become a great warrior, and then BAM he gets thrown into full blown WAR at fourteen. it's epigoni time people. he's the youngest there, this is the first time he's ever experienced real battle, and its in THEBES where his dad (who's ghost has been haunting him the whole time) DIED. anywhere he steps on the battlefield could be the very spot where his dad died. but he makes it through. they take the city, sack it, go home.
and that in itself is enough to make a man a legend, right? but almost as soon as he gets home, there's trouble in calydonia (where his grandfather is supposed to rule, but he gets usurped by an uncle or cousin or something). so he fucks off to calydonia to sort that out and ends up having to fight in ANOTHER huge battle to reinstate his grandfather as the king. but again, he pulls through, makes it out alive and goes home.
he gets married to aegialia, who's significantly older than him and who he doesn't know all that well just in time for adrastus (the king of argos and one of the original seven against thebes) to kick it. now, i'm not saying that adrastus was something of a father figure to him, but i think it makes sense narratively. so adrastus kicks it, and he inherits the city of argos, again being very young and not knowing much about ruling. he doesn't really get a chance to learn though because BAM it's trojan war time baby!!
so he gets together all the able-bodied argives (which is a LOT, like he's bringing a significant portion of the greek force) and they sail to aulis to meet up with the rest of the gang. sthenelus and euryalus (two of his buddies from the epigoni days) come with him - i like to think that they're like older brothers to him; sources he can look to for advice and support. ANYWAYS everybody gets to aulis, he goes to meet the rest of the kings and as soon as he introduces himself, everyone's talking about his father.
but its fine - even though he's proven himself to be a more capable warrior than his father was already. hes not here to cause a scene (no, they have achilles for that - but they dont have him yet so hold that thought), hes here to do a job. and do a job he will, because someone has to go fetch achilles from hiding! better send the young guy who MIGHT be able to hold his own against the strongest warrior in the world if he decides to fight back. and odysseus, of course.
they couldn't be more different, he and odysseus. odysseus is older, he's not been in a battle like this before, he has a son, he's generally regarded as a good king. whereas all he's ever known is war, he barely knows his own wife (DEFINITELY not enough to have a son), and he knows next to nothing about being a king. yet they hit it off. odysseus is charismatic and funny and he's ENRAPTURED by the way he talks about ithaca. he's never known anything like that. argos is home, sure, but ithaca is EVERYTHING to odysseus.
they collect achilles, with some trickery, and the real trojan war starts going. ILIAD TIME it's been nine years. he and odysseus are buddy buddy now (athena boys in business fr), achilles is on the fritz throwing a temper tantrum (NOT in a useful way on the battlefield). agamemnon is talking about giving up. menelaus ALMOST got paris's ass but aphrodite spirited him away. he and odysseus are holding this operation together. he's putting all this previous war experience to good use absolutely KILLING IT on the battlefield. he's going after aeneas, and then aphrodite, and then ARES the GOD OF WAR HIMSELF. achilles has NOTHING on him at this point. but the whole army is still praying for achilles return.
but it's fine - even though he's single handedly running the show at this point. he gets shot through the foot by paris and odysseus pulls it out because THEY WATCH EACH OTHERS BACKS, they look after each other. NIGHT RAID TIME, he and odysseus hit the town (and by hit the town i mean kill ~14 men under the cover of darkness and steal their horses), common athena boys W. they wash all the blood of themselves in the sea together afterwards, classic bro activities. he's feeding himself with odysseus's stories at this point because the way he talks about ithaca really does make it sound like something worth fighting for.
achilles comes back- OOPS, we thought it was achilles but its NOT its patroclus in his armor and now hes DEAD. achilles comes back for real, and now HECTOR is dead. who's that up on the walls of troy with a bow is that-? BAM, achilles dead, shot by paris. things are looking bleak and good at the same time. the palladium needs to be stolen so they can sack troy? easy money. NIGHT RAID PART 2, stealing the palladium time. easy money until odysseus decides to try and stab him in the back. he's devastated - his closest friend, caught up in the idea of having all the glory for himself. they've switched positions, now he is the one who wants nothing to do with this war, and odysseus is the glory-hungry king. heartbreaking.
TROJAN HORSE, the time is finally ripe to sack troy. everyone's behaving badly, people are getting raped on temple steps, it's a mess. odysseus throws a baby off the walls of troy. he's one of the only ones who doesn't get caught up in it because he's tired. he's tired of war and he wants to go home, even though argos is nothing like the home he's built in his head. there is no wife and son to return to. he knows nothing about being king. the rocky coasts of ithaca do not await him.
troy burns. the war is over, the ships are loaded with spoils, he sets sail for home. he arrives to find that sthenelus's SON, his BROTHER's SON has been fucking his wife and usurped his throne. and for a minute, it looks like he's about to go to war again, but he's tired. he's tired and it's his best friend's son, and it's a woman he never really got to know or care about and it's a throne he never asked for. so he just leaves. he takes his spoils, gets back on a boat and leaves. for ithaca.
he doesn't know how odysseus is going to react when he shows up. but, as it turns out, he didn't have to worry about that because odysseus isn't there. but penelope is. wise, patient penelope who listens to him talk about the war at troy and odysseus and how he's so tired. penelope who says, stay.
so he stays. and he waits for odysseus. and he learns things that aren't war. he learns what it feels like to carry a little boy on his shoulders. he learns what it feels like to have dirt under his nails and a sore back after a long day's work at the plow. he listens to penelope talk about odysseus, and shares his own stories too. he learns that he likes penelope, a lot.
enough that when the suitors start pouring in, he fends them off as best he can. he won't marry her - he won't do that to odysseus, but he will help her unravel the funeral shroud she's weaving each night. he will hold her while she cries for her husband who is likely dead at the bottom of the sea. he will start teaching telemachus his way around the blade when he asks.
and when odysseus does return home? he almost gets stabbed. odysseus is FURIOUS that someone he TRUSTED would come to court his wife, but that's not what happened at all, he's been protecting her the best he can. teaching his son to do the same. he's been waiting for odysseus with them. it's a teary reunion, of course, and then it's a bloodbath and then all the suitors are dead. he washes the blood out from underneath his nails for the last time.
see? do you see? it's about being HAUNTED by the legacy of a man you didn't even know, and it's about EXPECTATIONS and it's about figuring out what YOU want instead of what you're 'supposed' to want, and it's about GROWING past being a warrior and learning to be a PERSON, and it's about LOVING someone in a way that's beyond platonic or romantic. do you get it now? do you get it?
And they were war-mates
An old friend came to visit 😌
Diomedes thinks they should use it to torture prisoners
Headcanon he keeps a picture of his wife tucked inside his armour and can and will take it out and show it and then talk hours about his wife to whoever poor soul happens to ask about the piece of parchment poking out from his armour
Agamemon:We have to talk about a serious problem
Diomedes:Odysseus lack of childhood/family trauma ?
Menelaus:yes, it's so weird right ?
Diomedes:Do you ever wanna talk about your son Achilles ? Achilles: No Odysseus:I do Diomedes:I know, Odysseus Odysseus:I am the father of Telemachus Diomedes:I know Odysseus
Odysseus: [to the Achaeans, who are gathered around a coffee maker] So... who broke it? [Nobody says a word] I'm not mad. I just want to know. Antilochus: I did. I broke- Odysseus: No, no you didn't. Agamemnon? Agamemnon: Don't look at me. Look at Achilles. Achilles: What? I didn't break it. Agamemnon: Huh. That's weird. How'd you even know it was broken? Achilles: Because it's sitting right in front of us and it's broken. Agamemnon: [leans in on him] Suspicious. Nestor: If it matters - probably not - but Diomedes was the last one to use it. Diomedes: Liar! I don't even drink that crap! Nestor: Oh, really? Then what were you doing by the coffee cart earlier? Diomedes: I use the wooden stirrers to push back my cuticles; everyone knows that, Nestor! Antilochus: Ok, ok! Let’s not fight! I broke it, let me pay for it, Ody! Odysseus: No! Who broke it??! Achilles: [looks at Thersites, then at Odysseus] Odysseus... Thersites is been awfully quiet. Thersites: REALLY?? Achilles: Yeah! Really. Thersites: Oh, my gods! [everyone starts arguing at one another except Odysseus] Odysseus: [to the camera] I broke it. It burned my hand, so I punched it. I predict ten minutes from now they'll be at each other's throats with war paint on their faces and a pig head on a stick. Odysseus: [turns to look at the Achaeans as they continue to argue, then looks back] Good. It was getting a little chummy around here.
Odysseus:sometimes I cheat in uno Menelaus:WHY WOULD YOU DO THAT ?? Odysseus:so I win Diomedes:win what, dishonor Odysseus:STOPP Menelaus:stop dishonoring yourself
Menelaus trying to do an icebreaker: So what is your funniest childhood trauma ? Odysseus: my what ?
Hc that Odysseus feels a little left out because he's the only one who doesn't have childhood trauma to share.
⚠️It does not justify their actions and in a culture and period full of war and suffering⚠️
My favorite headcanon about gods and the mortals is that gods never understand how fragile humans are and don't understand how deep god's touches go through mortal's skin. (or simply don't care)
Athena will make Diomedes's grip on his spear stronger pushing his fingers tighter and almost breaking his bones. She fixes his position making his stance perfect, but human's body was never able to get into position this perfect so his muscles will be tearing and his bones will be cracking just to be instantly healed. When Athena removes her hands, his body will be covered in bruises.
Odysseus will always feel burning and at the same time freezing gaze on his back while Athena watches him across the battlefield. His ears will be filled with her breath and whisper, that will ring in his head long after she ended speaking. She will help him shot an arrow, and he will feel his joints moving in the way they were never supposed to move.
When Apollo turns all the spears and arrows away from the Hector he will still feel them digging into his flash. Apollo will raise him from the dust again and again, and Hector won't be able to stand without hearing god's voice in his ears and feeling god's burning touch on his shoulders. He closes his eyes and still sees the light.
Helen will stand tall to speak up to Paris, and Aphrodite will place her hands on Helen's shoulders to remind her of goddess's presence and this flaming grip will weight as heavy as ten years of war. Aphrodite will wash Helen's face so her skin will shine brighter and eyes will haunt every man in the room, and the only thing Helen feels is her skin freezing from the coldness of Aphrodite's hands.
And those touches won't end with battle or even with war. Every time Diomedes fights he will feel his body taking the exact position Athena once made him in, his limbs will come into shape they were never meant to be in, without deforming cause Athena already fixed them, once she already designed him according to her vision. Every time Odysseus lies his words will echo in his head just like Athena's words did before, every time he uses a bow, arrow in his hands will feel like a burning torch or like an ice, and his joints and tendons will sing in a perfect copy of the song Athena made them perform inside his body on the battlefield. Every time Helen will square her shoulders to feel herself more confident she will feel burning touch on her chin pushing it up and freezing breath in her hair. She will look at her husband and shadow of tight grip on her shoulders will become shadow of sharp nails digging into her skin, holding her in place.
Even dying at Achilles's hands and falling to the ground Hector would still hear an order in his head telling him to get up and fight, his own blood running down a neck will feel like Apollo's hands forcing him back to his feet.
No mortal ever forgets a god's touch.
Diomedes:Do you ever wanna talk about your son Achilles ? Achilles: No Odysseus:I do Diomedes:I know, Odysseus Odysseus:I am the father of Telemachus Diomedes:I know Odysseus
Funny that wasn't Agamemnon the one ruining it up
(゜ロ゜)
Diomedes: this is so embarrassing guys I'm so sorry!
Agamemnon: it's not that bad
Odysseus: as you should be
Menelaus: don't be sorry!
Nestor: WHAT do you MEAN you fucked up again do you need YOUR BEAUTY REST so you can stop being A DISGRACE to the whole army I swear I will-
I hate Dante´s Inferno for this, but I understand his point of view on Greek "heroes", being Italian he supported romans and who were they? Troyans; so where would you put the ancestral enemies of your ancestors, in Heaven, are you crazy? in the INFERNO, Where they´ll burn for all eternity!
Also I exposed in another tweet that in Dante´s Divine Comedy or what I like to call All against me are sinners and deserved to die, here´s theological proof TM. Odysseus´s life after the Suitor´s death is one of longing of adventure, ABANDONING PENELOPE AND TELEMACHUS, FOR FAME AND ADVENTURE, entering hell for the end.
deep breath...
As we can see the Divine´s Comedy is against Ody´s;, he´s leitmotiv was returning back to Ithaca ( Nostos); so as customary to the Romans, the Greeks are viewed and written trough a bad lens, like Achilles, Patroclus, etc..
Also a character that helps Dante for much of the book is based on a historical figure; Virgil who was also roman and the author of the Aeneid, who as you know is an Odyssey and Illiad ripe-off, like way on the nose. So is no brainer to put these two, Odysseus and Diomedes, in hell for destroying and sacking Troy, Rome´s alleged homeland.
Ooh! Aw :) the Odysseus/Penelope/Diomedes ship makes me SO SAD because in Dante's Inferno Odysseus returns to sea years later with Diomedes (leaving Penelope alone) and they both die and are punished for their wanderlust/dissatisfaction with life and they're like tied and burning together and :((( not only do they have to hear eachother being tormented, they also left Penelope alone, saying they'd return like last time, except this time it was actually, finally a lie :(((
Taking Diomedes away from him let my boy live in peace
Taking Odysseus away too let my other boy live in peace
Iirc correctly in the Aeneid, Diomedes is said to be living peacefully in his founded city? I like this. Go babygirl, live a life of peace after being so entrenched in war. There are also some posthomeric myths that say he becomes a god, offered immortality by Athena. I think that's funky. Go babygirl be a god
Also YELLING about Odysseus, why do people keep killing him off far from home when his entire story is about getting home. Weeping. Let him have his gentle death. Let him grow old with his lady love
Don´t know why, but in the first panel Odysseus looks like he looks so goofy, like he´s eyes are not well placed, but then you see they´re well aligned, kudos for the artist!
Because i don't know were else to publish this
@sol-thorne Hi! Please don't make a Telegony or similar, please don't have THAT work in mind for inspiration, pls, There's so much more.
Hope the best and have fun doing so! And amazing art!
Currently working on a graphic novel (which will still be a concept until an editor decides it's worth paying me to complete), I don't have much yet, working on concept pages. For now have those character drawings as I keep working on scenario and storyboarding-
The temporary title is Odysseus: the last journey, and it's going to be pretty much a sequel to the Odyssey. Featuring Telemachus, Diomedes, and a lot of old and godly faces.
Diomedes: You tried to stab me.
Odysseus: OVER THE PALLADIUM! That's how important you're to me.
Athena: Interesting, let the man talk.
Diomedes: He's playing with your pride, Athena. Don't listen to him.
Athena: Be more lenient. You know he has problems.
Diomedes: He has- I've been nothing but obedient to you but "he has problems"! Your favor, that's what he has.
Athena: I have no favorites. I let you hurt two gods.
Diomedes: You commanded me to hurt two gods.
Athena: How would you like to hurt Aphrodite again?
Diomedes: No, I want Odysseus punished.
Athena: Fine. You get to your home safe. And you get home after ten horrible years.
Diomedes: Deal.
Odysseus: No deal. I want to see my wife!
Athena: No, do not look at me with those eyes. You've been nasty out there.
Odysseus: I'm not nasty, I'm family driven.
Diomedes: *sighing* goddess, you're smiling.
Athena: He's adorable!
Odysseus: when i was your age- Diomedes: when i was your height- Odysseus: now listen here you little shit.